My opinion and experience is that Renderhub is really satisfying, there are no Testers that anonymously can grab your assets for free judging on them, it stay's in the creators responsibility to release a satisfying product. Once you hit the post button it is published, you can edit, update your product and post with no delay at any time. Avoiding that a Tester needs to pull out the finger out of hes's a** and hope that it will show off after a few day's standing under a dictatorship. Customers can contact you personally and ask for a fix and update that can be done in no matter of time and updated on the product release also for all other customers with no delay caused through testing's.

If your products are crap, it will show on the ranks, customers will avoid your shop, you have to make refunds, you have no future, you gain no fallowers.

If the customers and products are satisfying then you get a boost, you get fallowers and collectors for your releases and make comparable to other brokers better earnings. I was on rotica yes and I was not pleased at all, with the max of 100 buck a month compared to 500 buck - 3k on RH , considering that every broker charges between 50% and 40 % fee " Even RH " making it up to 6k sales. Top notch vendors with a big group of fallowers even boost up over 6k a month. " I am not in that category as Sex would sell better " 

Concluding that for a Creator it sure is a positive aspect on RH, also not getting the feeling to be just a cheap employee of some Broker, getting more self responsibility for the releases, leaving you even the freedom to promote other places you sell your products or your own webstore. 

 

ShelLuser posted at 12:18 AM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498134

Now, an important disclaimer is in effect: I don't really bother myself with "politics" and also don't keep up with every shift in power. However... @Putitadelamierda2 is fully on the mark here, I've also heard stories told by vendors and mentioned by "my" staff; vendors who moved away from Daz (to "us" amongst other markets (probably Renderosity too!)) and they definitely mentioned that one of the most compelling reasons to move was not being allowed to sell elsewhere other than Daz.

I don't know how far and deep this actually goes (whether this is also set up in contracts and what not) but if you hear this mentioned from multiple vendors... then something stinks (IMO).

Do note that I don't want to make it sound as if vendors constantly walk away or stuff like that, I don't know. But I do share Putita's opinion, based on what I've heard.

Ok. Thanks for your input.

This is what I think: Folks like DeeceyArt say they were not well treated. I believe that. Folks like FirstBastion say the market has got tougher, less lucrative. I believe that, too. Folks like JoeQuick have not been creating lately - A couple years, it seems. That happens. Folks like RawArt are going full tilt and only sell at Daz store. Folks like Zeddicuss and Powerage are apparently going strong and sell multiple places.

It all suggests there might be soft tiers for the vendors. With respect to multiple marketplaces, the only actual hard rule I've heard is that Daz doesn't want folks selling their Daz products outside the Daz store. Sensible! But I'm not a PA or vendor. So, there's still a lot of grey area and speculation. Not sure filling in the blanks will solve anything, but it's the topic du jour, so I'm going with it. 

If there is strong pressure from Daz store to keep their vendors in the Daz store, I would guess that's because their PAs have access to specialized vendor tools in DS, and Daz wants to keep products made using those proprietary tools on the Daz site. If those tools are not used, that may have an effect as well. It's speculation. >_>

@Versum You're describing no quality control, good reason for big distrust. As customer, I probably would not buy from you. Also I've never heard of you. What do you even do?

@ Torquinox

you probably would not, tastes are quiet individual when it comes to models, and customers have there preferences :)

Versum posted at 2:28 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498166

@ Torquinox

you probably would not, tastes are quiet individual when it comes to models, and customers have there preferences :)

Oh. Summoner. It's you! Why didn't you just identify yourself to begin with? Yeah, I know, you're meticulous, you make custom figures, and you don't have a quality problem. So I take it back. My only cause for concern is your commitment to fan arts. You say it's commercial license, but that's tricky when you're recreating people's stuff. I suppose it depends if it's just "inspired by" or copied. Without necessarily knowing the source, it's hard to know. Same problem, every store!

ok this might be a little in your style direction, who knows, at least from what I can see in your gallery. Love doing these nasty, creepy, slimy, creatures.

Torquinox posted at 9:39 AM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498158

It all suggests there might be soft tiers for the vendors. With respect to multiple marketplaces, the only actual hard rule I've heard is that Daz doesn't want folks selling their Daz products outside the Daz store.

First: Thanks for your kind (unquoted but easily looked up) words, appreciate it. Looked up your profile because of it, found your gallery, grinned at your "Abomination" (omg, loving it!).

I'd like to share yet one more take. Unfounded, no sources, no leads, nothing more but personal (unfounded!) experiences. Only fair because IMO it should work both ways.

So, I'd like to mention that it's also fair to state that people who have beef with someone or some company are also more prone to speak up (negatively) vs. people who are just happy with the way things are going. Please don't read between the lines here (looking at you random reader!).

Totally unfair comment (!) => how long ago was it since someone tried posting a tutorial here? ;)  Not directed at you Torq (obviously!) but meant in general.

Kinda ironic.. on YouTube people beg you to follow them and then I click that 'x' button. Yet with conversations such as these...  ok, totally offtopic ;)  moving right along...

Daz has no issues with people selling at other stores, as long as they are different products - there is no such thing as a Daz exclusive vendor. Of course tools like the HD importer and dForce hair are limited to items being sold at Daz.

Well Fan Art is requested in loads, getting flooded with requests, actually a normal behavior of Poser Ds users, they watch a game of thrones, some Star wars, admiring these characters and evidentially want to be part of it. they just want it in there collections, a little like kids who make a cape and stick a "S" on  the chest to be as long Imagination lasts a Superhero.

Artists often tries to fulfill dreams, make others happy to feel happy him self, not really all about money, So it often happens that just to give a little smile give he's best to fulfill a little dream.  

 so all good Torquinox , could not really just say, Hey I'm summoner , that is the point where I often just get kicked out LOL 

RHaseltine posted at 3:26 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498172

Daz has no issues with people selling at other stores, as long as they are different products - there is no such thing as a Daz exclusive vendor. Of course tools like the HD importer and dForce hair are limited to items being sold at Daz.

Yes, that's what I was getting at - not as well-worded, though.

Versum posted at 2:57 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498168

ok this might be a little in your style direction, who knows, at least from what I can see in your gallery. Love doing these nasty, creepy, slimy, creatures.

That guy is pretty cool! Your work looks great! Hat's off to you!

I buy stuff from pretty much all of the 3D places, even the lesser ones like Artstation, Gumroad. etc. I've had to make many returns at Daz, too many to count, a few returns at Renderosity, I think 2 actually, and I've never had to make any returns at RenderHub or Renderotica. So As far as trust goes, having product testers really means nothing. There's been many horror stories of the low quality product that is allowed at Daz. There are vendors there who do nothing but make figures with duplicate formulas, there is a "star" vendor there who pretty much does nothing but take other people's models, and then make HDRIs out of them. Sometimes going as far as repackaging free HDRs from polyhaven. I will never buy anything from him. And lets not get started on the NFTs, the Yellow AI fiasco, or the short lived Daz AI web thing. There's vendors there who make very nice looking products in the promos, but which are almost universally unuseable, because of the poly count, texture size, etc. I have a blacklist of vendors at Daz because of this. It's that bad. 

Allowing reviews on a site is the biggest factor in trust. I'd rather have honest criticism in the comment section for a product than rely on unknown product testers, who may or may not have an agenda. if you are getting something for free to test, of course you are going to be swayed by that and not give a completely honest critique or you most likely won't be asked to do product testing again for that vendor. We all know how this works. You can look at the movie industry or videogame industry, the insiders who get freebies to test are never (or rarely) completely honest with criticisms. Whereas, 10 reviews from average end users who paid for the product and tested it on there own, are much more trustworthy to me.

So I have no problem spending money at Renderhub or Renderosity who both allow end user reviews. I can see right away which vendors and products to avoid. If you can't allow reviews on your site from the end user, that is a huge red flag to me. Daz has always been vehemently opposed to this for "some reason". They seem to think people will spend money on a product only to viciously leave unwarranted bad reviews. And yet this is not a problem at any other site, odd isn't it? "The wicked flee when none pursue" comes to mind.

I only rarely spend money at Daz anymore, and its only because they have an extremely liberal return policy within the first 30 days which is at least a safety net. Unfortunately, I have bought things there which have been broken past 30 days by studio updates or updates by the vendors themselves. So to be honest my trust for Daz today is lower than all the other stores combined. It wasn't always like this, i used to spend thousands a year there.  It's also creepy that they have their mods patrol these boards as well and do damage control here. 

RHaseltine posted at 3:26 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498172

Daz has no issues with people selling at other stores, as long as they are different products - there is no such thing as a Daz exclusive vendor.

So, no exclusive vendors, still exclusive products. Sorry Richard, but that is hurting vendors just as much. And pretty much confirms what I was talking about above.

Ironic... I had a very personal (and honest!) talk with my 'not "official"' boss just a few hours ago (I know I kinda went all out here) and they told me... "you do you, we're good either way!". I don't care for politics, but I have a helluvalot of respect for open and honest markets (and being honest myself)..

How ironic indeed....

One of my all time favorite vendors is Aiylaf Learning, though people here on Renderosity know them as Aiylafrn. I'd like to point out Gretta Gardenia. Trust me: unlike "other market places" the product image actually tells you exactly what you can expect (ok, ok: apart from the headband). I hope readers can trust me again because: what you see is what you get. Seriously. Why the confidence? Because I tested this product myself months ago and here's the thing: I understand bias, if you're one of my list favorite vendors... you need to be on your best to pass my tests.

At the time of writing (1 day left!), 50% off at $8 added up. Meanwhile, on "my" site of the 'naughyness' "we" sell this for $15. 

(seriously random reader: this is a steal!  Even the elven ears are but an optional morph!).

Here's the thing... I'm not new to this place (Hi Loki!), and while I do have a soft spot for "that other place", I also only got as much to spend. Got myself an awesome kimono only last week.

... and then we soon get into a position where "we" provide the best deal. Seriously: I've seen this many times before. How long after the Renderosity sale ends before "we" get the "best" deal? 

In the end the people profit, and both markets profit by showing mutual respect for one another (I'd like to think there's a good reason why my "boss" told me "you do you"). 

Because once again: I can't help but wonder how long it'll take after this sale ends before Aiylaf (= how I know them) will apply a discount on "our" market. And then "we'll" do "better" than this place, but only for so long.

In the end buyers profit, both markets profit and left's not forget: the vendors profit.

Sorry to go here, but trying to force a vendor to only sell a product on one market only almost makes me wonder if some people are scared of a little competition.

... you do realize that my "allegiance" is with Aiylaf here, right? I'm venting as much for Renderosity as I do for "my place" at times. And I (almost) always have a cool deal to point out. Raising my "credibility" (blech!) but most of all: vendors are selling, no matter what I say.

Just my 2 cents here of course... Truthfully I have no idea about actual figures and quotes.

Sorry for a double post y'all...  I know... I need to be sharper, and also improve my profile pic soon enough!

RHaseltine posted at 3:26 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498172

Daz has no issues with people selling at other stores, as long as they are different products - there is no such thing as a Daz exclusive vendor. Of course tools like the HD importer and dForce hair are limited to items being sold at Daz.

Just wondering: does 35% ring any bells with you? ;)

Versum posted at 3:26 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498173

Well Fan Art is requested in loads, getting flooded with requests, actually a normal behavior of Poser Ds users, they watch a game of thrones, some Star wars, admiring these characters and evidentially want to be part of it. they just want it in there collections, a little like kids who make a cape and stick a "S" on  the chest to be as long Imagination lasts a Superhero.

Artists often tries to fulfill dreams, make others happy to feel happy him self, not really all about money, So it often happens that just to give a little smile give he's best to fulfill a little dream.  

 so all good Torquinox , could not really just say, Hey I'm summoner , that is the point where I often just get kicked out LOL 

re: Fan Arts: I understand. Makes sense, too.

re: could not really just say, Hey I'm Summoner: Haha! That would have made it simpler for me! Whatever impression I might give, I've got a lot of respect for you, your work, and your ingenuity!

ShelLuser posted at 3:14 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498169

Torquinox posted at 9:39 AM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498158

It all suggests there might be soft tiers for the vendors. With respect to multiple marketplaces, the only actual hard rule I've heard is that Daz doesn't want folks selling their Daz products outside the Daz store.

First: Thanks for your kind (unquoted but easily looked up) words, appreciate it. Looked up your profile because of it, found your gallery, grinned at your "Abomination" (omg, loving it!).

I'd like to share yet one more take. Unfounded, no sources, no leads, nothing more but personal (unfounded!) experiences. Only fair because IMO it should work both ways.

So, I'd like to mention that it's also fair to state that people who have beef with someone or some company are also more prone to speak up (negatively) vs. people who are just happy with the way things are going. Please don't read between the lines here (looking at you random reader!).

Totally unfair comment (!) => how long ago was it since someone tried posting a tutorial here? ;)  Not directed at you Torq (obviously!) but meant in general.

Kinda ironic.. on YouTube people beg you to follow them and then I click that 'x' button. Yet with conversations such as these...  ok, totally offtopic ;)  moving right along...

Thank you for your kind words and the follow!   

Fair to state: True! I agree. 

I saw your tutorial thread. I like it. Cheers to you for starting it!

ShelLuser posted at 6:44 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498184

Sorry for a double post y'all...  I know... I need to be sharper, and also improve my profile pic soon enough!

RHaseltine posted at 3:26 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498172

Daz has no issues with people selling at other stores, as long as they are different products - there is no such thing as a Daz exclusive vendor. Of course tools like the HD importer and dForce hair are limited to items being sold at Daz.

Just wondering: does 35% ring any bells with you? ;)

No.By default Daz PAs get 50%, the top-sellers get more (which is obviously an incentive to put as much as possible at Daz for people who are on the edge of qualifying).

Torquinox posted at 5:58 PM Fri, 25 July 2025 - #4498125

Putitadelamierda2 posted at 4:56 PM Fri, 25 July 2025 - #4498123

It's a toxic relationship, PA's desperately seek greener fields other than the main site, some straight up quit, and those who don’t sell their products exclusively with them are targeted and pressured to stop any activity outside their platform (Secondary shops, Patreon, Artstation...), or face consequences.

And you have heard these things from one or more top vendors? 'Cause I don't really think anybody is giving Powerage, Zeddicuss, Midnight_Stories or their like any grief. And I don't think Stonemason, Rawart, Luthbel, Linday, Oso, Josh Crockett, etc are planning to leave any time soon. Mada has come right out on the forum to say Daz gives her extra opportunities to make money. So, sure, you could be right, but prove it!

A couple of months back on DA, I contacted directly, an artist that was working on a BEAUTIFUL project for g8-9. In that convo, it was said directly to me (still have the inbox) that if they do sell it at daz it can only be at daz. 
This was not the first vendor that has told me the exact same thing. There have been vendors that have made this information very public numerous times. Its to corner the market, its to make it so people -have- to go to DAZ if they wish to purchase certain artists items. It is literally how DAZ Is keeping afloat. 
Not from great customer service, that is for sure! 
Anyone that has remotely spoken to a "Daz asset" artist knows this. 
The other common knowledge, is that they may make the bulk of their profit in the first couple of weeks to month of release. 
Other artists actually lose money due to “sales” that DAZ runs. 
This again, is common knowledge. You can go find it yourself. Don't just take our words on it!
The “Top artists”, yes, they are getting a better deal. DAZ gives them “spotlight” attention...because they know if those artists go...that is it for them.
If those artists you named ever left daz or offered their products as a direct buy...I would never go back to daz. And many of us would leave to give our money directly to those artists. 


As to "Heavy handed by mods"...you must be an artist of understatement. 
Breathe a word that looks negative or they THINK is negative and your post is gone. It is why I literally screen cap every post and thread I post in now. 
This is not just my view. This has been repeated ad naseum by people. People that are not just randomly bringing up small things!
Big issues like say....support tickets from 2023 that are just now getting answered?
Like products, they admit, do not work "as they should" but refuse to fix. 
Like dubious IP licensing or lack there of...
Valid, solid issues. That should be addressed to the customer base of any site.

As to "its their site..." yes. You are right. It is. But it is also a BUSINESS that they are running internationally.
There is a base code of practice for most businesses. 
They also dance around their own TOS and yes, I can say that with assurance and proof. 

No other business would get the leeway DAZ is being given for 2-year-old support tickets! Or products that constantly do not meet what is advertised! 
That is a flat out fact. 
Tell me, if you bought a TV and you got it home. It didn't work. You contacted the store, and they were like…we will respond in 2-5 business days and…nothing.
You then contacted the manufacturer, and they just told you "our products are GREAT! NOTHING WRONG" and ignored you. Didn't respond etc...
That you would be ok?

You would just "Oh well hooodee hooo" and toss the TV and go get a new one?

I do not think so.
Or if you had that issue with the hypothetical TV and it took 2 years to get a reply?
You would be ok?
Would ANYONE be ok with that?

Yet, complain about DAZ doing -exactly- that and suddenly its acceptable for a company to do?
Logic fail.

Torquinox posted at 2:48 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498167

Versum posted at 2:28 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498166

@ Torquinox

you probably would not, tastes are quiet individual when it comes to models, and customers have there preferences :)

Oh. Summoner. It's you! Why didn't you just identify yourself to begin with? Yeah, I know, you're meticulous, you make custom figures, and you don't have a quality problem. So I take it back. My only cause for concern is your commitment to fan arts. You say it's commercial license, but that's tricky when you're recreating people's stuff. I suppose it depends if it's just "inspired by" or copied. Without necessarily knowing the source, it's hard to know. Same problem, every store!

Your reply...changed the moment you recognize the Summoner name. 
THAT says allot. You werent taking them at their word, until you realized it was a familiar name. 

My experience at Renderhub is like Summoner stated, the artists respond (and from my experience) fast. I dont think I have ever waited more than maybe 24 hours for a reply. They take on board what you feed back or ask. They are willing to work with you. 
I have had an artist request to use one of my pieces in their gallery for a product. So they are not just putting up the "tester artists work" but "work that is 'in the field' used"
The reputation there is based on quality and artist response to customers. 
End...of.

And that is why more and more of us are going there. 

GeorgeWeber posted at 5:11 PM Sat, 26 July 2025 - #4498181

I buy stuff from pretty much all of the 3D places, even the lesser ones like Artstation, Gumroad. etc. I've had to make many returns at Daz, too many to count, a few returns at Renderosity, I think 2 actually, and I've never had to make any returns at RenderHub or Renderotica. So As far as trust goes, having product testers really means nothing. There's been many horror stories of the low quality product that is allowed at Daz. There are vendors there who do nothing but make figures with duplicate formulas, there is a "star" vendor there who pretty much does nothing but take other people's models, and then make HDRIs out of them. Sometimes going as far as repackaging free HDRs from polyhaven. I will never buy anything from him. And lets not get started on the NFTs, the Yellow AI fiasco, or the short lived Daz AI web thing. There's vendors there who make very nice looking products in the promos, but which are almost universally unuseable, because of the poly count, texture size, etc. I have a blacklist of vendors at Daz because of this. It's that bad. 

Allowing reviews on a site is the biggest factor in trust. I'd rather have honest criticism in the comment section for a product than rely on unknown product testers, who may or may not have an agenda. if you are getting something for free to test, of course you are going to be swayed by that and not give a completely honest critique or you most likely won't be asked to do product testing again for that vendor. We all know how this works. You can look at the movie industry or videogame industry, the insiders who get freebies to test are never (or rarely) completely honest with criticisms. Whereas, 10 reviews from average end users who paid for the product and tested it on there own, are much more trustworthy to me.

So I have no problem spending money at Renderhub or Renderosity who both allow end user reviews. I can see right away which vendors and products to avoid. If you can't allow reviews on your site from the end user, that is a huge red flag to me. Daz has always been vehemently opposed to this for "some reason". They seem to think people will spend money on a product only to viciously leave unwarranted bad reviews. And yet this is not a problem at any other site, odd isn't it? "The wicked flee when none pursue" comes to mind.

I only rarely spend money at Daz anymore, and its only because they have an extremely liberal return policy within the first 30 days which is at least a safety net. Unfortunately, I have bought things there which have been broken past 30 days by studio updates or updates by the vendors themselves. So to be honest my trust for Daz today is lower than all the other stores combined. It wasn't always like this, i used to spend thousands a year there.  It's also creepy that they have their mods patrol these boards as well and do damage control here. 

Very well said!

DarkElegance posted at 3:05 PM Sun, 27 July 2025 - #4498215

Your reply...changed the moment you recognize the Summoner name. 
THAT says allot. You werent taking them at their word, until you realized it was a familiar name. 

Yes, I give Summoner special dispensation. Not everyone does work the way he does. I've conversed with him a bit over time and scoped out some of his work. So, I feel comfortable doing that in his case. 

Torquinox posted at 4:21 PM Sun, 27 July 2025 - #4498219

DarkElegance posted at 3:05 PM Sun, 27 July 2025 - #4498215

Your reply...changed the moment you recognize the Summoner name. 
THAT says allot. You werent taking them at their word, until you realized it was a familiar name. 

Yes, I give Summoner special dispensation. Not everyone does work the way he does. I've conversed with him a bit over time and scoped out some of his work. So, I feel comfortable doing that in his case. 

And yet you automatically assume someone else is lying? Not being factual? Because its not a “recognized name”?

The answer they gave didnt change. Your view of it did.  So someone you "like" is honest, but anyone else...is not?

You do not see an issue with that?

Why didnt you just take a person that has first hand experience from Renderhub as being honest? They gave their honest experience. 
What was there to doubt?

DarkElegance Please understand, I am not required to believe everyone I meet on the interwebs. And I'm not required to blindly trust someone I don't know, know of, know about, etc. And you need to stop hassling me for having a different opinion than you do on this topic. Ok?

Ok; this might grow into a misunderstanding of interests, and there should be no need to judge where a Creator or Customer feels best to find a stay. It is a personal preference.

Giving you some examples: I have my own site " Freedom of Art " running over a decade for Poser and DS, I run a second store on Renderhub, so what happens!? Customers will be on the place they feel better, no matter if the price "in my case" is higher on Renderhub then on my own site due the broker charge. The phenomenon is that even that a customer know the fact of my own and could save would rather support Renderhub then my site, why is this ? It is because they have there preferences and stay where they feel more Conformable, same with my site, members feeling comfortable would not go to renderhup getting my products.

This might be the same with any other site, like here  or Daz  for either party Vendor and Customers, they just stay where they feel happy. What happen now escalates into a misinterpretation of the situation, I gave my opinion about Renderhub knowing that it might result as provocation for some as personal interests always can end up into conflicts with other interests. 

Without trying to influence any personal preference, there is to consider that  Torquinox might be a member of "Freedom of Art" rather then Renderhub, be it the case then it is a justified choice of interest.  Due the fact that I run two places as far as I can see this situation might of escalated, not giving price who I am in first place. Torquinox probably just did not want to mention my Private site that is fully understandable in these forums. 

Anyone has the right having the freedom to be where they feel best without being offended :) 
 

 

So.... IMO this is a very interesting thread, lots of different takes on things, comments which can be picked up as official (or close enough), I learned a thing or two.

But at the same time I also can't help but pick up a lot of personal bias (also from myself!). Yet therein lies a problem. I see people above complain about Daz3d customer service. I actually needed / wanted their help 2 times in total, and the last time (several years ago) was to request a refund because I was kinda upset with the quality of the product I bought. No questions asked, it got processed in a few days and I was asked to please remove the item from my computer (I had already done this, but still you guys... talk about a display of trust). This is kinda on-par with what I assume is the official Daz3d refund policy (I tried finding something more recent but...).

Meanwhile....  Renderosity's refund policy is quite clear: if you download the item you basically accept it for what it is. "That other site I talked about" roughly uses the same approach.

And if there's one thing I know about refunds it's that it's a (major) market expense. Time, administration, money... while the store makes no profit. I think there's a good reason why both Daz3d as well as Steam make it perfectly clear that if you abuse the service then you may be fully denied refunds completely.

Then there's also the issue of Daz3d doing more than just being a marketplace: providing & maintaining software such as Daz Studio, but let's also not forget about the Daz Install Manager. Software development... is also a whole other level of expenses. That too should be factored into any criticism I think. It's easy to make comparisons when you only have a 3d marketplace in mind where the community is basically doing most of the work and where your own overhead expenses are only so much.

Not trying to "play" both sides here, but I just want to emphasize that even though I don't agree with some posters above, I do agree with what they're trying to say (assuming I picked up their message correctly): There's (usually) always another side to a story.

As always... just my 2 cents here. And I really need to work on my avatar ;)

ShelLuser posted at 5:25 AM Mon, 28 July 2025 - #4498231

So.... IMO this is a very interesting thread, lots of different takes on things, comments which can be picked up as official (or close enough), I learned a thing or two.

But at the same time I also can't help but pick up a lot of personal bias (also from myself!). Yet therein lies a problem. I see people above complain about Daz3d customer service. I actually needed / wanted their help 2 times in total, and the last time (several years ago) was to request a refund because I was kinda upset with the quality of the product I bought. No questions asked, it got processed in a few days and I was asked to please remove the item from my computer (I had already done this, but still you guys... talk about a display of trust). This is kinda on-par with what I assume is the official Daz3d refund policy (I tried finding something more recent but...).

Meanwhile....  Renderosity's refund policy is quite clear: if you download the item you basically accept it for what it is. "That other site I talked about" roughly uses the same approach.

And if there's one thing I know about refunds it's that it's a (major) market expense. Time, administration, money... while the store makes no profit. I think there's a good reason why both Daz3d as well as Steam make it perfectly clear that if you abuse the service then you may be fully denied refunds completely.

Then there's also the issue of Daz3d doing more than just being a marketplace: providing & maintaining software such as Daz Studio, but let's also not forget about the Daz Install Manager. Software development... is also a whole other level of expenses. That too should be factored into any criticism I think. It's easy to make comparisons when you only have a 3d marketplace in mind where the community is basically doing most of the work and where your own overhead expenses are only so much.

Not trying to "play" both sides here, but I just want to emphasize that even though I don't agree with some posters above, I do agree with what they're trying to say (assuming I picked up their message correctly): There's (usually) always another side to a story.

As always... just my 2 cents here. And I really need to work on my avatar ;)

In reference to the “customer service” issue.
As I have noted before in other threads. Some responses from DAZ were great. There is a new person that is responding to tickets and I don't know who they are, but kudos to their honesty, their bluntness and their "on the ball" mentality. The fact they are saddled with trying to deal with tickets that are from 2023, not their fault. 
I appreciate their responses and have told them that. 

BUT...when there is a blatant dropping of the ball and instead of going "hold on, we messed up. let us fix it". They go and try to make it the customer's issues and not theirs, or flat out ignore it. No. that is not acceptable. 
And when that happens more than, say...5-10 times. It's not a "one off". 
(And I am not the only one that experiences this)
I too, have had an issue of "This is not what I was expecting when purchasing" and the person replying, was like "ok let me do your refund". Guess what. No issue!
But when an item is provably, not what is being sold(first reported back in 2018). Is continued to be sold broken. And they ignore a request for a refund? Then TWO YEARS LATER, reply to the ticket? THAT is a VALID issue.

When you report an issue such as many of us have over the subscription thing…and it is flat out IGNORED. That is a VALID issue.
I am not the only one being vocal about it. 
When a customer is sitting for years, trying to get some response, some action, some resolution for a valid issue…yes. They get angry. Rightfully so.  We are not talking about "Oh I thought the texture would be a different colour" issue…we are talking about products being unusable. File associations not working at all (and they admit it!), Financial loss on a subscription that had no declaration and was purposefully missold. 
Those are valid issues. Issues, a customer has every right to be angry about, frustrated about...VOCAL about.

And btw, I get vocal about good service too. Just as I have noted here Renderhub, I have had (to date) no issue at all. The artists have been fast to reply, fixes offered, the support staff there reply to customers…I have had nothing to complain about. You get to work directly with the artists. 
I am also vocal when it comes to artists that have great products. One of my absolute fav artists((romarovprivate),  I made sure to leave feed back on. (btw for those looking for bang for buck...cant beat their products. Details, quality, usability, *chefs kiss*)
I happily point people to artists that provide great assets and customer service. 


People get pushed to a limit, to the wall and when they stand up and go "NOPE" and become vocal...perhaps look at the reason they are being so vocal instead of making out like they are just being difficult. 

Torquinox posted at 7:53 PM Sun, 27 July 2025 - #4498224

DarkElegance Please understand, I am not required to believe everyone I meet on the interwebs. And I'm not required to blindly trust someone I don't know, know of, know about, etc. And you need to stop hassling me for having a different opinion than you do on this topic. Ok?

You are right. You arent. But at the same time, automatically assuming someone is not being factual? 
(and that is why I keep, as they say, receipts)

Also, I find your stance incredibly interesting actually...seeing as a convo you started with me back in 2023 via site mail. Where you were concerned over IP licensing with daz.
(actually had to double check that. I for a moment, thought perhaps I had the wrong name...but I wasnt mistaken)

Wow! Well, there's a lot I want to say, and I can't actually say any of it - It would just drag the thread down another, deeper rabbithole. So, cheers to ShelLuser! Good to see you here, Versum. Sorry, DarkElegance.