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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2025 May 22 4:27 pm)
Subject: THUNDERSTORM CREATIONS-EULA
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The hair in the picture is Reika hair by minerva! Not Rei hair by Kozaburo. Mazak
From the base look of it, I'd say your EULA is quite reasonable, and asks nothing that wouldn't be common sense anyway. It places no undue restrictions, and asks for no unreasonable conditions (credit on any work created with the product, for example. I won't say who currently uses such a condition, but I won't be buying any of her work). It's also written in plain English, which makes it that much easier to read and understand. Well done.
Actually as copyright holder on my items S i can change the terms by allowing people to insert the EULA into the zip files they already have. Is this what steffyzz did when that whole blackhearted thingey broke out a while back? i have victoria, of course, but very little stuff from other folks...well, a few "necessities" from daz....and, i do LOVE eowyn's textures, bebop's too. anyway...she's really a nice looking model...and you did a beautiful job on the ad.... hummmmm...so, now i can see why some are boycotting daz...doh....cause they can put their new eula in their new purchases, and, if what you say is true...they can effectively stop folks from creating their own poser clothing to fit the m figures.... yayyy!!! i just learned something. booo, not too sure i like what i found out.
well, changing from license / readme in the file to calling it an end users license agreement. otherwise it is the same. exactly the same restrictions and permissions we have in all our items archives. if there is one of our items that restricted use to non commercial only ( really don't think so ) then by putting the EULA as written into the archive you have, you are removing said restriction, with our permission. both of us have always tried to only restrict redistribution for our items.
Storm...noooo...your eula is sweet and to the point. and, you seem to be knowledgeable about eulas. as you know, some of us think that of late, there has been some abuse of them. so, basically, if i downloaded an old file of yours...back in 1999, and, i had a "readme" file...that would be my eula, yes? but, if i downloaded your new lovely lady...would my old file terms change? or, could i choose to change the terms of usage by using that "readme...errr...eula" as my new terms? can you retroactively change the eulas of the past with a new eula? like i said..you seem to know a good bit about this...and, you might be the one to clarify alot of the issues that have lately bewildered us....('cuz chad smith didn't say anything much but double talk)
shadowcat S sure you can :) You have our agreement to use our copyrighted copyright terms LOL ;) Poppi.. Anything of mine, and Thunderstorm Creations If you find one without these terms you can go ahead and add this into your file. Not that there likely is one out there without these terms but still S Yes for TSC items and items by Stormrage you may change the EULA it does change (by my permission)whatever terms were written in the Readme of all items that I have made (as long as you want to change it:)) Yes You can retroactively change the eula's in this form because it is a voluntary thing and the EULA is giving you freedom to do basically anything but redistribute the file. Now as for items you buy. No it can't be changed that easily. Again this is done on a Voluntary basis. You can change the terms by including the above EULA in my zips old or new. You do it on a voluntary basis. Can daz do it? Yes they could but it would Have to be done on a voluntary basis. Meaning the buyer agrees that they want it in there on their older files. They canNOT however change the terms to more restrictive terms retroactively. They can send out a EULA with new terms but You have the right not to accept them. You cannot be forced to accept new terms, especially on items you buy. You can however accept terms that are better. Which I believe ours are clearing up a lot of issues on whether you can use our stuff commercially. You can accept them or reject them as you want to :) now this EULA only applies to items by Stormrage or Thunderstorm Creations, it DOES NOT change the terms on anyone elses items.
Pablo, one of the states made legalese illegal. requiring all legal documents and communications to be in plain english. I think it was texas, but not sure. ~L~ gee and I only posted the eula to show a good clear exapmle and remind people the we don't restrict use, only redistribution. but that's ok. don't think anyone will be upset at being able to alter our terms to it, since it makes sure they can do anything but redistribute they want with our props or characters.
Storm...i thank you. why? because you have clearly put all that daz has been double talking about. i will d/l your character...she's gorgeous...and, lol...even make a render with her...have not shipped up a render to this place since march....you have clarified alot, here. i will go about my modelling, as usual....i deleted so much, over this last daz stuff....so many hours...not to mention the hours spent, after work, learning how to model, and, then conform...and, finally just to uvmap and texture...then, that bit from daz...well, i basically gave up. i am so glad you posted this eula thread...i still have my models on my machine at work...yaayyyy!!!!! i still don't understand chad's daz double talk. i understand what you are saying. thanks, again. Poor, precious Poppi
For anyone who wants it. Here is 2 agreements one the Freedom EULA posted above and the other Restrictive Non-commercial agreement Just copy past into notepad and save then use when you want S Storm EULA- Freedom -----------------------------Copy------------------------------------------------------------------------ Company(or Personal Name) Copyright date By using this product you agree to the following * You will not redistribute in whole or in part any of the files included within the archive, nor the archive itself. . * You will not offer said archive or files for download on your site unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product * You will not offer this archive or files on cd unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product. * You will not offer this archive or the files on any peer to peer program that is available now or in the future. You are granted the rights to use this item: * to create non- commercial renders and images * to create commercial renders and images COMPANY NAME believes that you have the right to use the images in the way you wish. If you have the opportunity to sell your artwork please do without fear that we will hunt you down :) --------------------------------------------ENDCOPY----------------------------------------------------- EULA- Restrict 1 - Non commercial Work ----------------------------------------------COPY---------------------------------------------------------- Company or personal name copyright date By using this product you agree to : * You will not redistribute in whole or in part any of the files included within the archive, nor the archive itself. . * You will not offer said archive or files for download on your site unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product * You will not offer this archive or files on cd unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product. * You will not offer this archive or the files on any peer to peer program that is available now or in the future. *You will not use this item in any work that is commercial in nature.(ie you get paid for it) You are granted the rights to use this item: * to create non- commercial renders and images ----------------------------------------------------------END COPY------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Asshole EULA Company or personal name copyright date By using this product you agree to : * You will not redistribute in whole or in part any of the files included within the archive, nor the archive itself. . * You will not offer said archive or files for download on your site unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product * You will not offer this archive or files on cd unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product. * You will not offer this archive or the files on any peer to peer program that is available now or in the future. *You will not use this item in any work that is commercial in nature.(ie you get paid for it) * You will not use this item in any work that is Non commercial in nature * You will not use this item for public display * You will not use any of the items in the archive at all * You will not install any of the files onto any computer less than a 7 ghz Pentium 9 computer * You will not View any image contained in the archive * You will not create any derivative works out of any of the files in the archive * You will not download this archive at all
The legality of this is questionable. Your position seems to be that you think the license comes into force when the user uses the item, whether or not he/she has read the text. This cannot be the case, or all sorts of stupid scams would be possible, along the lines of the jokes posted above. They are not jokes. If your EULA has legal force, so would the jokes have. In practice, neither have legal force. I don't agree to anything just because you tell me I do. The only thing that has legal force in this case is ordinary copyright law. As it happens, all your terms are already covered by copyright law, so your "license" is unecessary. I suggest you get rid of it.
Phantast, I'd almost agree with you. This license is basically covered by copyright law. Clearly stating that both commercial and non-commercial images are ok is good and saves answering questions... and reiterates that it is their right to give such permissions. However, there are a lot of idiots out there who don't know what copyright law covers. I've had to go to court too many times because of publishers who thought they could take and mangle and use without paying. Would spelling it out prevent theft? Maybe. Among kids and the illiterate. At least they would know what was allowed and what was forbidden. I've had to talk to opposing lawyers and found them refreshing: rather than being assholes (to follow the jargon above), they usually understand the legal importance of each word... and don't let emotion or wishful thinking get in the way. Instead of rewriting the law, I'd rather refer to established law and know that the courts will accept those phrases as legally binding. People tend not to like legalese, but it exists for our protection, too. What I would choose to do for myself might not be serviceable for people who have had other experiences or who are in other markets or who are responsible for others. On a further note: I respect someone who speaks cautiously when representing a company. Chad or Steve or Dan can't breezily rewrite the law to please people who aren't lawyers: not when they have a company full of people whose livelihoods depend upon the laws as written and as decided in court for a couple of centuries. If someone has difficulty with an explanation, maybe they should judge by actions? Until the road to Draper resembles the entrance to Vlad Dracul's fortress, I'm not going to worry. Carolly
Well - you can't rewrite the law (just as well, too), and phrases are not legally binding if they are not accepted by both parties, and merely asserting that the user agrees to something doesn't make it so. "Forbidden" is a strong word. You can forbid people to do this, that and the other in a readme file as much as you like, but don't imagine this has legal force. It is better to think of the conditions in a readme as a request, which the user certainly ought to respect (otherwise the donor gets pissed off and goes away). But the conditions of use in a readme file only have real force in so far as they are backed up by existing law. So if you say "Please do not redistribute this file without permission", and someone does, you can get them for copyright violation. But if you put in "This model may not be used in religious artworks", or "It is forbidden to use this file if your first name begins with P", you have no recourse in law at all if someone disregards this.
Phantast, Actually, all agreements come into force when you INSTALL the item whether or not you have read the text files included. That is why Daz's, DSI, and other installers have the agreement first, this includes software. YOU agree to these agreements when you click the agree button on the software, same thing with zip files whether or not you have read the agreement. That one I do know because I have gone to court on it. But since you did raise a valid point. I think I will start making exe files with the agreement clearly stated before you install the product So you can agree or disagree and if you disagree to it the product won't install
I recently found out it is very inportant to read the EULA before installing anything, MS recently released an upgrade to mediaplayer & in their EULA it states the user agrees to giving MS automatic admin access rights on their pc, I didn't find out till after I installed as I didn't read the license, who does tho? Rob
Rob, exactly That's why it's important to read everything in the installer when you Install anything. May be time consuming and annoying as hell, but you learn important things about what they are truly asking. Same thing as with TOS on sites when you sign up for a website. Free or not. You never know when you could be giving them the right to download your art and use it on their sites.
Rob, I'm glad my comp has linux on it. the gpl doesn't have any wierd rights for people in it. ~g~ it boils down to: I can do anything I want with the program(s), as long as I include a copy of the gpl when redistributing it. and I make available the source code for the program. the graphics suite I'm working on for the linux os is a gpl project. that means that it comes with the source code, when it is finally released. ( which means when it's functional ) your download times for sharon probably be faster, since I have the x-server running. it was probably when the comp went into powersave mode when it was that slow. yes, sharon is on server on my laptop, the comp I'm using to post this. ~g~
Stormrage, (a) I don't agree that clicking a button means I agree to anything even if it says I do. If I say "by turning off your computer, you agree to pay me $100", does that mean you owe me $100 next time you switch your pc off? (b) Even if clicking a button did mean anything, it's up to someone else to prove that I clicked it. The fact that a bit of software is installed on my computer is not proof that I installed it. My next door neighbour could have come in and clicked the button.
"The fact that a bit of software is installed on my computer is not proof that I installed it. My next door neighbour could have come in and clicked the button." That sounds like a dodgy premise to me, Phantast. If your neighbor planted child-porn on your computer, or explosives in your basement and they caught you, do you think they'd believe you? Generally, a person is held to be responsible for the contents of his own personal property. "it's up to someone else to prove that I clicked it" And THAT statement is even dodgier! mac
Phantast.. Whether you agree or not If you buy and install 3d Max, or poser, or any software you agree to their agreement, whether you have read it or not. It's a contract between you and the company. Once you click agree.. or your neighbor or your dog, and it is on your computer then you are responsible for upholding that agreement. Doesn't matter WHO installed it and who clicked agree. It is a legal and binding contract. If you bought a new computer with win xp on it or any version of windows on it, whether or not you agree to the agreement, since you didn't install it, by using that computer and everything on it YOU are responsible for upholding the agreement. Plain and simple. ANY copyright lawyer will tell you that. That's why all boxed software usually comes with a print out of the liscense agreement, and no matter if you read THAT or not it is still binding if you install the software. Try your excuse on a judge and he'd laugh and tell you to research the laws, plain and simple. This is a matter of copyright law. So it is governed by Copyright laws. Now under the copyright law what any software company or any body doing when they give something away for free is allowing you to use their copyrighted item under a specific agreement, It doesn't matter what You believe is right but if you use an item without reading the text files, liscense agreement,et all you are still responisible for them. Whether you have read it or not. If you have pirated copies of programs on your computer, and the police bust in and grab your comp whether or not you agreed to the liscense in the software where it states you will not install "warez or illegal software" YOU are still charged with piracy. and under copyright law be taken to court for damages. I take back my earlier statement that the asshole EULA can't be enforced. It can actually, not all of it, but some of it can be UNDER COPYRIGHT LAW. Remember ignorance doesn't matter when it comes to law. License. A license is a contract in which a party with proper authority (the "licensor") grants permission for another party (the "licensee") to do something that would otherwise be prohibited. (Online Law) taken from http://www.siia.net/piracy/copyright/law.asp The Law in the United States Software is automatically protected by federal copyright law from the moment of its creation. The rights granted to the owner of a copyright are clearly stated in the Copyright Act, Title 17 of the US Code. The Act gives the owner of the copyright "the exclusive rights" to "reproduce the copyrighted work" and "to distribute copies ... of the copyrighted work" (Section 106). It also states that "anyone who violates any of the exclusive rights of the copyright owner ... is an infringer of the copyright" (Section 501), and sets forth several penalties for such conduct. Those who purchase a license for a copy of software do not have the right to make additional copies without the permission of the copyright owner, except (i) copy the software onto a single computer and (ii) make "another copy for archival purposes only," which are specifically provided in the Copyright Act (Section 117). The license accompanying the product may allow additional copies to be made; be sure to review the license carefully. Software creates unique problems for copyright owners because it is so easy to duplicate, and the copy is usually as good as the original. This fact, however, does not make it legal to violate the rights of the copyright owner. Although software is a new medium of intellectual property, its protection is grounded in the long-established copyright rules that govern other more familiar media, such as records, books, and films. The unauthorized duplication of software constitutes copyright infringement regardless of whether it is done for sale, for free distribution, or for the copier's own use. Moreover, copiers are liable for the resulting copyright infringement whether or not they knew their conduct violated federal law. Penalties include liability for damages suffered by the copyright owner plus any profits of the infringer that are attributable to the copying, or statutory damages of up to $100,000 for each work infringed. The unauthorized duplication of software is also a Federal crime if done "willfully and for purposes of commercial advantage or private financial gain (Title 18 Section 2319(b))." Criminal penalties include fines of as much as $250,000 and jail terms of up to 5 years. The Law in Canada Software is automatically protected by federal copyright law from the date of creation. The rights granted to the owner of a copyright are clearly stated in the Copyright Act, R.S.C 1985, c. C-42. The Act gives the copyright owner the sole right to produce, reproduce or publish the work or any substantial part thereof in any material form whatever, and to rent out the computer program (Section 3). It also states that "copyright in a work shall be deemed to be infringed by any person who, without the consent of the owner of the copyright, does anything that, by this Act, only the owner of the copyright has the right to do" (Section 27(1)), and that a copyright shall be deemed to be infringed by any person who sells or lets for hire, distributes, exhibits in public or imports for sale or hire into Canada any work that infringes copyright (Section 27(4)). Persons who purchase a copy of software have no right to make additional copies without the permission of the copyright owner, except for the right to make "a single reproduction for backup purposes" and "a single reproduction of the copy by adapting, modifying or converting the computer program or translating it into another computer language if the person proves that (i) the reproduction is essential for the compatibility of the computer program with a particular computer, (ii) the reproduction is solely for the person's own use, and (iii) the reproduction is destroyed forthwith when the person ceases to be the owner of the copy of the computer program (Section 27(2)(l) and (m)). Software creates unique problems for copyright owners because it is easy to duplicate, and the copy is usually as good as the original. This fact, however, does not make it legal to violate the rights of the copyright owner. The unauthorized duplication of software constitutes copyright infringement regardless of whether it is done for sale, for free distribution, or for the copier's own use. Moreover, copiers are liable for the resulting copyright infringement whether or not they knew their conduct was in breach of the law. Penalties include liability for damages suffered by the copyright owner plus any profits of the infringer that are attributable to the copying (Section 35). In addition, copiers who knowingly infringe copyright may, on conviction on indictment, be fined up to $1,000,000 and imprisoned for a term of up to five years (Section 42). Use of Software Anyone who purchases a license for a copy of software has the right to load it onto a single computer and to make another copy "for archival purposes only." In Canada, the purchaser of a licensed piece of software has the right to load it onto a single computer and to make another copy "for backup purposes." It is illegal to load that software onto more than one computer or to make copies of that software for any other purpose unless specific permission has been obtained from the copyright owner or otherwise permitted in the license accompanying the software program. The law applies equally, for example, to a $25 game and a $750 project management program. Each product reflects a substantial investment of time and money by many individuals. Software development involves a team effort that blends the creative talents of writers, programmers and graphic artists. Piracy diminishes the value of a program and further, deprives the developers of fair compensation. Software piracy inhibits innovation. The software industry is filled with new developers trying to break into a crowded market. They can survive only if their products are purchased. Each theft makes staying in business more difficult. Rental of Software It has always been illegal to rent unauthorized copies of software. However, concern over the fact that the rental of authorized or "original" software frequently resulted in the creation of pirated software led Congress to enact the Software Rental Amendments Act of 1990 (Public Law 101-650), which prohibits the rental, leasing, or lending of original copies of any software without the express permission of the copyright owner. The same situation prevails in Canada. In 1993, Parliament amended the Copyright Act to include the rental of software as a distinct right which cannot be exercised without the express authorization of the copyright owner. These provisions came into force on January 1, 1994. Use of Software by Schools Public or private educational institutions are not exempt from the copyright laws. To the contrary, because of their unique position of influence, schools must remain committed to upholding the copyright laws. Just as it would be wrong to buy one textbook and photocopy it for use by other students, it is wrong for a school to duplicate software (or to allow its faculty or students to do so) without authority from the publisher.
Actually, using an exe could solve the pcf problem as well. If you don't have the required obj file, it won't install. The tradeoff is people's (somewhat justifiable) fears about running downloaded executables.
"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken
...only somewhat justifiable? ::shudder:: This beastie may be the Internet scapegoat, but letting it accept and run executables would be like printing a menu for the upcoming carnage. Besides, I do almost all my art on a Mac. Executables don't infect, er affect, Macs. There must be other ways to check for a required seed file without pulling up the entire plant, or sowing weeds. Carolly
I was being somewaht sanguine by using somewhat :-) Unfortunately, virus writers are like the famous Willie Sutton, they go for the PCs cause that's where the money (or in this case, the most targets) are. I keep forgetting all the Mac folks, so an exe would not be a viable solution anyway. The current soultion(s) work fine but it would be nice to be able to click a pcf and have it decode without the file searching hassle. Now if CL built decryption into Poser so that you could "sign" a file for distribution and Poser would only open it if the required keyfile were available... But then I shouldn't give them ideas.
"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken
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By using this product you agree to the following * You will not redistribute in whole or in part any of the files included within the archive, nor the archive itself. . * You will not offer said archive or files for download on your site unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product * You will not offer this archive or files on cd unless otherwise agreed to in writing by the creator of this product. * You will not offer this archive or the files on any peer to peer program that is available now or in the future. You are granted the rights to use this item: * to create non- commercial renders and images * to create commercial renders and images Thunderstorm Creations believes that you have the right to use the images in the way you wish. If you have the opportunity to sell your artwork please do without fear that we will hunt you down :)