"So I guess you don't own a new computer or a TV or a gaming console, a mobile phone or any other of a million consumer products that are evolving on a daily basis, Dalek?

Why does anyone buy the latest version of anything? They want access to the latest tech and features whether incremental or groundbreaking in nature.

If V4 suits your needs then thats all you do need, but for a whole bunch of others they want access to a modern figure with modern tech driving it forward, progression.

In fact you could probably still get by on a Pentium 4 if you only want to type a daily diary on it.

What is SMITH MICRO's business model by the way, Sell Poser, Sell Upgrade ad infinitum, sound familiar?

Ummm well when I buy an iPhone 6 I don't need to go out and re-buy all my apps, when I choose to buy a poser upgrade I get to use all my existing content, when I upgrade my computer I don't have to upgrade all my programs, when I upgrade my car I don't have to buy a new house to put it in...   When I upgrade to V7 I have to replace everything...  buy her new content, Download Studio 4.8 buy all the add ons that make it work somewhat like poser, move all my existing content over to Studio 4.8 sort out the content that no longer works, learn a new program, replace the content that no longer works... and so on.... $$$$$$$$$

No you are completely correct they are obviously exactly the same issue... how silly of me. (Yes that is sarcasm)

If you already use Studio 4.8 from the start then good on you. I have nothing against V7. I just think it is a huge pity that it is transparently done as Studio only, and really for what I see as marginal benefit in the final render. I can make V4 put on a goofy expression... I did not see anything in the V7 Promo that made her a MUST buy or even unique. Oh yes I forgot, she supposedly has an anus... silly me. Now where do I download Daz Studio 4.8 with Iray again?

Please continue and chase the rainbow, I'm happy for you, its still just a bunch of light rays except made by expensive polygons.

As a DAZ user, Genesis was a marked improvement over V4/M4 if for nothing else then the vastly improved morphing system.  Add too many morphs to V4 and her belly would crinkle when you tried to make her smile.  Genesis did have some problems though, it was great for creating monsters, but lousy at realistic looking humans, Genesis 2 was an improvement on that.  Vendors over here never really supported Genesis, there were a few items, but with Genesis 2 the floodgates started open.  As Zevo said, the main push to Genesis 3 seems to be getting in line with industry standards which will make Genesis more portable to just about everything other than Poser.  That will probably help the PA's, the market will be potentially bigger.  For somebody like me who uses it mostly to create comics, it isn't necessarily a selling point, I'll have to see how much better the facial expressions are (they were abysmal with Genesis, but pretty good with Genesis 2).  Those are important for what I do.  The fact the UV maps don't port, that's a big negative.  We'll have to see what options become available there, for the moment that is going to keep me from doing too much with it.

If you're happy with what you have, I am happy for you.  To those that are bashing DAZ though, if you really don't like DAZ that much, why are you wasting time in this forum?

Seems like every time one turns around DAZ has a new generation/series of characters.

Me, the Poser 2014 user, is still stuck with V4 and M4...

Hmmm.... hadn't read through all the pages.  This one apparently started out in the Poser forum, then got moved to DAZ.  All the nonsense makes much more sense now.  Except for the part about why anybody would have started it in the Poser forum to start with, but, er, never mind.

Hmmm.... hadn't read through all the pages.  This one apparently started out in the Poser forum, then got moved to DAZ.  All the nonsense makes much more sense now.  Except for the part about why anybody would have started it in the Poser forum to start with, but, er, never mind.

They start to bash DAZ3d and Genesis, when they start losing the argument they proclaim "This is the Poser forum. You DS users get out".  Nevermind a Poser user actually started the mess, but get out. ;)  

Same recipe for the last 5 years. More jade than anything else, considering dwindling or substandard figure support they've been getting in the marketplace since Genesis' introduction.

Doesn't make me feel bad that I paid for Poser 10 in a $39 bundle with 7 other apps and I use the picture framer that costs $25 more.

This is a DAZ thread now:) Bwahahahahaha.

 I went through a bag of popcorn today. Such drama and discontent.

Kind of like watching the breakup of a bad boyfriend that thought he was more important than he was and when he got put out, he's actually shocked it happened when she was actually doing all the work in the house. "I can't support you any longer"

Long time coming, long time coming. 

I'm about to switch over to the "dark side". first iRay, now G3F and V7. Looking foreward, how SM will try to win me back. (g) :D

Never thought I'd say this in a million years, but I think I'm with ya o.O. DS looks better all the time now that there's Iray. I'd be a really happy camper if I could use my own dynamic cloth in it then the transition might be complete. :P

Laurie

it's always left to Zev0 to make the argument about market forces. This is what drives DAZ 3D, it's not emotion.

With every figure we see the same. I don't need this or that, etc. You may not, but there are others that do, and those others are in the majority, who don't frequent forums. I am willing to bet that V7 is being purchased like mad. There are those who have been waiting for a more lifelike superior figure and DAZ 3D is filling in that need excellently.

You are entitled to that opinion so I will not argue on the substance except how do you quantify the majority need the latest and greatest.  Looking at the galleries on line the majority care very little for the latest and greatest and either do not use the old figures to the full or, occasionally, are doing stunning renders with V4 figures and figures even earlier.  I accept that the majority do not frequent the forums but then how do we know what they want. I have no issues with Daz developing V7 and I have no doubt it will sell well, not that we will ever no the truth because no one in the know will admit it if it does not.  

Actually, as an affiliate I have an idea.
The same was said about Genesis and Genesis 2. And yet, they sold like hot cakes and so will this one. And if you say you don't see many renders with these new figures it just goes to show that the majority of purchasers have other ideas in mind when they they purchase, it isn't to post art on the web.

Having written the above I now know why these debates are better left to those who are married to their favorite software.

For somebody like me who uses it mostly to create comics, it isn't necessarily a selling point, I'll have to see how much better the facial expressions are (they were abysmal with Genesis, but pretty good with Genesis 2).  Those are important for what I do.

This is why I am a great candidate for this new figure. Expressions. I am so tired of the manikin look. I want a figure with facial character. This is why my Genesis 2 figure purchases had to have HD.

it's always left to Zev0 to make the argument about market forces. This is what drives DAZ 3D, it's not emotion.

With every figure we see the same. I don't need this or that, etc. You may not, but there are others that do, and those others are in the majority, who don't frequent forums. I am willing to bet that V7 is being purchased like mad. There are those who have been waiting for a more lifelike superior figure and DAZ 3D is filling in that need excellently.

You are entitled to that opinion so I will not argue on the substance except how do you quantify the majority need the latest and greatest.  Looking at the galleries on line the majority care very little for the latest and greatest and either do not use the old figures to the full or, occasionally, are doing stunning renders with V4 figures and figures even earlier.  I accept that the majority do not frequent the forums but then how do we know what they want. I have no issues with Daz developing V7 and I have no doubt it will sell well, not that we will ever no the truth because no one in the know will admit it if it does not.  

Actually, as an affiliate I have an idea.
The same was said about Genesis and Genesis 2. And yet, they sold like hot cakes and so will this one. And if you say you don't see many renders with these new figures it just goes to show that the majority of purchasers have other ideas in mind when they they purchase, it isn't to post art on the web.

Having written the above I now know why these debates are better left to those who are married to their favorite software.

You missed the point, if the users don't post in galleries and don't frequent forums how does anyone know, including you, what the majority want.  We have limited and some biased data that the others sold lot hot cakes, but accepting that they did, still does not mean the majority did, will or want to. Now I will fully agree with you for the desire in your later post on better expressions and that could well sway me towards V7 but nothing I have seen yet is an improvement. Believe me I would be happy if someone could show me the expressions have improved.   

it's always left to Zev0 to make the argument about market forces. This is what drives DAZ 3D, it's not emotion.

With every figure we see the same. I don't need this or that, etc. You may not, but there are others that do, and those others are in the majority, who don't frequent forums. I am willing to bet that V7 is being purchased like mad. There are those who have been waiting for a more lifelike superior figure and DAZ 3D is filling in that need excellently.

You are entitled to that opinion so I will not argue on the substance except how do you quantify the majority need the latest and greatest.  Looking at the galleries on line the majority care very little for the latest and greatest and either do not use the old figures to the full or, occasionally, are doing stunning renders with V4 figures and figures even earlier.  I accept that the majority do not frequent the forums but then how do we know what they want. I have no issues with Daz developing V7 and I have no doubt it will sell well, not that we will ever no the truth because no one in the know will admit it if it does not.  

Actually, as an affiliate I have an idea.
The same was said about Genesis and Genesis 2. And yet, they sold like hot cakes and so will this one. And if you say you don't see many renders with these new figures it just goes to show that the majority of purchasers have other ideas in mind when they they purchase, it isn't to post art on the web.

Having written the above I now know why these debates are better left to those who are married to their favorite software.

You missed the point, .... Believe me I would be happy if someone could show me the expressions have improved.   

I am sure we will see some soon. Some clever PA will also add to them. I asked a person to post some extreme expressions. I am sure I will see his work soon. It will give me a better idea of what to expect out of the box.

This has some nice examples. http://www.daz3d.com/victoria-7-attitude-expressions

Oh, BTW. You don't really have to purchase V7. V7 is based of G3F and G3F is free. So anyone who really wants to see the new figure in action can just grab DAZ Studio for free.

I still prefer V4 over G2F, V4 looks great with some tweaking morphs to correct some issue with her, the only thing that makes me sad is less new stuff come out for her now.

Daz tends to love upgrading figures all the time to make you buy yet more stuff , G2F has been out hardly anytime and it annoys me how they constantly brought out new figure bases for GSF , a few support outfits and then no more content for those figure bases again, just the next figure base, seems they are now following the pattern with first vicky 5, then vicky 6 and no more support for vicky 5, and now vicky 7 and no more vicky 6 support no doubt, im glad in a way im using poser as i wont be tempted to spend more on constantly updating Genesis versions with previous versions forgotten, think ill just stick with V4 from now as I much prefer working with her anyway and think she looks better.

I'm a DAZ user but after G2 I've grown tired of trying to keep up.   Esp. since I find myself still turning to V4 sometimes to do what I want.  

I think I'm just going to settle for being a generation behind and buy GX-1 stuff when all the prices drop after the next newest figure releases.  I don't think I'll have to wait that long to see it happen to G3. 

Here are some more Victoria 7 expressions. http://www.daz3d.com/feel-it-mix-and-match-expressions-for-victoria-7

As a Poser user I was stupid enough to start this V7 discussion in the "poser" thread as I thought stupidly that V7 not being Poser compatible was relevant to Poser Users like me... how stupid.

Obviously as she is not Poser compatible it is obvious that this belongs in the Daz Studio Thread as she is Studio compatible and Obviously that is completely obvious that users of Poser should obviously not discuss or mention a Daz product in a Poser thread and it was stupid to assume otherwise.

Please can all users of Poser therefore stop talking about V4 as clearly despite her being Poser compatible she is a Daz product and you are stupid to mention her there obviously, unless in a purely Poser context.

Obviously I had no idea that in my stupid naivety things had declined into partizan Poser and Studio camps that don't talk any more except to point and sneer about where a discussion should take place rather than the topic, so that the minutiae of having a discussion in the Poser thread about a brand new Daz product that is now revealed to be for the first time Daz only compatible was stupid obviously, and belonged as a discussion for Poser users about a Daz product obviously in the Daz Thread, but now I know better than to try.

So lets fight about something worthwhile.

I would now like both Poser and Daz camps to consider which end of a boiled egg to open, and which way round a toilet roll should be new sheets out to the room or to the wall, and then ignore the topic and discuss which thread that should be in? top/bottom/in/out.

As a Poser user I was stupid enough to start this V7 discussion in the "poser" thread as I thought stupidly that V7 not being Poser compatible was relevant to Poser Users like me... how stupid.

Obviously as she is not Poser compatible it is obvious that this belongs in the Daz Studio Thread as she is Studio compatible and Obviously that is completely obvious that users of Poser should obviously not discuss or mention a Daz product in a Poser thread and it was stupid to assume otherwise.

Please can all users of Poser therefore stop talking about V4 as clearly despite her being Poser compatible she is a Daz product and you are stupid to mention her there obviously, unless in a purely Poser context.

Obviously I had no idea that in my stupid naivety things had declined into partizan Poser and Studio camps that don't talk any more except to point and sneer about where a discussion should take place rather than the topic, so that the minutiae of having a discussion in the Poser thread about a brand new Daz product that is now revealed to be for the first time Daz only compatible was stupid obviously, and belonged as a discussion for Poser users about a Daz product obviously in the Daz Thread, but now I know better than to try.

So lets fight about something worthwhile.

I would now like both Poser and Daz camps to consider which end of a boiled egg to open, and which way round a toilet roll should be new sheets out to the room or to the wall, and then ignore the topic and discuss which thread that should be in? top/bottom/in/out.

The problem is really you have Poser zealots that barely buy anything bullying Poser users that buy content into not discussing things in 'their' forum.  DAZ subjects are fine when they are being bashed, but if you want information on a DAZ product, expect the war to break out. Unfortunately those people don't realize the environment they've created when they choose this behavior. If those people choose to drive you out of the forum for asking or discussing certain topics, you can imagine where those people ultimately go.. and buy product. Hence the situation now. If people choose to drive out their members because they don't like the topic, they shouldn't be surprised when the participation isn't there like it used to be. No one wants to participate in a negative environment.

They start to bash DAZ3d and Genesis, when they start losing the argument they proclaim "This is the Poser forum. You DS users get out".  Nevermind a Poser user actually started the mess, but get out. ;)
Same recipe for the last 5 years. More jade than anything else, considering dwindling or substandard figure support they've been getting in the marketplace since Genesis' introduction.
Okay, while that is true, the DAZ users are hardly innocent either (the whole "well Poser is dying, so nyah" crap)  In this case, I would say that Poser users have every right to be pissed royaly about this.  Hell, I have never used Poser, never will, and don't really like it, but this greatly offends and disgusts me as well.  DAZ basically sold out.

They start to bash DAZ3d and Genesis, when they start losing the argument they proclaim "This is the Poser forum. You DS users get out".  Nevermind a Poser user actually started the mess, but get out. ;)
Same recipe for the last 5 years. More jade than anything else, considering dwindling or substandard figure support they've been getting in the marketplace since Genesis' introduction.
Okay, while that is true, the DAZ users are hardly innocent either (the whole "well Poser is dying, so nyah" crap)  In this case, I would say that Poser users have every right to be pissed royaly about this.  Hell, I have never used Poser, never will, and don't really like it, but this greatly offends and disgusts me as well.  DAZ basically sold out.

The problem you describe doesn't happen all that often. It happens just like this thread did: -- A poser user, is angry about DAZ for some reason.

-- More poser users pile on. 

-- They get corrected or someone gives an explanation of why it is.

-- That dies down, someone starts asking questions.

-- Someone derails it with "This is the Poser forum"

-- Fights break out. People get personal.

-- Thread gets moved or gets locked.

Rinse and repeat.

And please explain how DAZ has sold out?

They are ultimately running a business, selling their content, and unfortunately supporting poser development doesn't justify the cost to continue. No one is being vindictive. If those customers don't buy the product, you eventually don't keep stocking the shelves with their goods. Simple business and nothing personal about it. 

You missed the point, if the users don't post in galleries and don't frequent forums how does anyone know, including you, what the majority want.  We have limited and some biased data that the others sold lot hot cakes, but accepting that they did, still does not mean the majority did, will or want to. Now I will fully agree with you for the desire in your later post on better expressions and that could well sway me towards V7 but nothing I have seen yet is an improvement. Believe me I would be happy if someone could show me the expressions have improved.   

This also misses the point there is quite clear data that the trend is swinging from Poser to Daz Studio. Have a look at a number of sources and the trend will be indicated the same. I would not go into this detail on the Poser forum but since this has now been plonked into the DS forum I see no reason not to reveal a little more on the issue. Firstly look at vendor support.

http://www.daz3d.com/vendor - have a look through this list and I think you will see a vast number of vendors who have migrated from Poser V4 support to Daz Studio Genesis Support.

So there is a trend of vendor changing markets. Usually the cause for this is that they have sampled the other market and found it more viable.

Vendors still at Renderosity are offering more and more Daz Studio Support also. Renderosity is slowly adding more DS sales and support.

Now look at website activity.

Visit Alexa.com it has some rankings based on traffic.

DAZ3D - Ranked 6444 in USA ---- Daily time on site is 15mins up 30%

Smith Micro - Ranked in USA 23 037 ---- Daily TIme on Site 3mins down 12%

Renderosity - Ranked in USA 11 762 ---- Daily Time on Site 10mins down 14%

Hivewire3d - Ranked in USA 300 236...

RuntimeDNA - Ranked in USA 35 932...

If you visit each website it's quite easy to see which has the most activity in the forums and galleries too. Compare the DAZ3D Forums to any other and you will see a clear leader for activity.

Industry Activity

When the largest content provider in the sector decides to stop supporting Poser for it's latest major product generation. It's a pretty clear indicator that it has analysed its surveys and sales data and decided it is the right time to do that. Meaning that the Daz Studio market is large enough not to need Poser support to continue. Or Poser oriented sales are not of a significant volume as that will be missed.

News Feed monitoring

Try going to google news and typing in Smith Micro and Daz3D - Daz3d reveal links to industry news and recent positive happenings with the company and it's products. Smith Micro reveal a portrait of a company with a falling share price .... its lost almost %90 of it's value in 5 years from $16 a share to $1.20... Type in Poser and there is not one relevant news feed on the first page of results.

So you can say that the data is limited or biased, but that is just not the case it's from quite varied and reliable sources that reveal an overall litmus test as to the state of Poser Smith Micro and Daz3D.

Firstly look at vendor support.

http://www.daz3d.com/vendor - have a look through this list and I think you will see a vast number of vendors who have migrated from Poser V4 support to Daz Studio Genesis Support.

So there is a trend of vendor changing markets. Usually the cause for this is that they have sampled the other market and found it more viable.

Vendors still at Renderosity are offering more and more Daz Studio Support also. Renderosity is slowly adding more DS sales and support.

Now look at website activity.

Visit Alexa.com it has some rankings based on traffic.

DAZ3D - Ranked 6444 in USA ---- Daily time on site is 15mins up 30%

Smith Micro - Ranked in USA 23 037 ---- Daily TIme on Site 3mins down 12%

Renderosity - Ranked in USA 11 762 ---- Daily Time on Site 10mins down 14%

Hivewire3d - Ranked in USA 300 236...

RuntimeDNA - Ranked in USA 35 932...

If you visit each website it's quite easy to see which has the most activity in the forums and galleries too. Compare the DAZ3D Forums to any other and you will see a clear leader for activity.

Industry Activity

When the largest content provider in the sector decides to stop supporting Poser for it's latest major product generation. It's a pretty clear indicator that it has analysed its surveys and sales data and decided it is the right time to do that. Meaning that the Daz Studio market is large enough not to need Poser support to continue. Or Poser oriented sales are not of a significant volume as that will be missed.

News Feed monitoring

Try going to google news and typing in Smith Micro and Daz3D - Daz3d reveal links to industry news and recent positive happenings with the company and it's products. Smith Micro reveal a portrait of a company with a falling share price .... its lost almost %90 of it's value in 5 years from $16 a share to $1.20... Type in Poser and there is not one relevant news feed on the first page of results.

So you can say that the data is limited or biased, but that is just not the case it's from quite varied and reliable sources that reveal an overall litmus test as to the state of Poser Smith Micro and Daz3D.

Ahh statistics. I really don't see this proves anything as to what system is more popular, or the argument about "is it worth dumping thousands of dollars of investment and following the bottomless pit that is Victoria 1- 45 and moving to Studio and locking into the DAZ business model". Vendor support:

As a vendor when an industry splits for example into both betamax and VHS one has to choose to support one or both, most seem to support both, some don't, I cannot blame them. Daz has always been the No 1 place for content... they made the base figure. But the number of Vendors spread across all the independent sites has always been bigger. Daz is encouraging vendors to NOT support Poser as part of its monopoly strategy. Yes the ultimate free market... one market. Mine.

Website activity:

Has this actually changed? I used to go to Daz all the time, I don't now, I never went to Smith Micro, its site was rubbish and always has been. Spend more time in renderosity now.

Industry activity:

When the largest content provider decided it was following a pattern of just doing content to drive people to its own software in a commercially driven move to destroy competition and dominate the market, it is acting under commercial shareholder pressure in a gamble that may pay off. They want to give the customer no choice, establish a monopoly and get all the cash. Thats what drives this, not "oh we can forgo Poser income" they are saying If you want our content you MUST use Studio. OK. Fair enough. I like to pause before I run off the dollar cliff with the other lemmings.

I'm also sure that all those happy people who invested in superior Betamax products were delighted when they were told they had to have VHS. Yea it happens... we don't need to be happy about it.

News Feed Monitoring:

Poser is just a program from a big software publishing house I would not expect it to be front page news it never has been. They don't really care that much about Poser any more than DAZ cares about its customers when it brings out a new figure with all new content every 6 months then dumps it. I used poser because the Daz customer service is terrible, its approach is arrogant, and unashamedly corporatist, treating vendors and customers like faceless ants. I did not want to reward the company for its behaviour by going Studio. I'm not claiming Smith Micro is any Better. It certainly is not any worse, and once I buy Poser I am done with them.

And I had a choice.

Daz wants a Monopoly. If poser shuts down I am absolutely sure Daz will instantly lower prices, give content for free and act counter to every monopoly in history! Of course it will. Did you spot the flying pig just then?

Neither company really gives a stuff about us the customer, we are walking wallets to be conned into buying new content every week or a "major upgrade" to a bug filled program.

I just think it is a shame when we turn into partizan nitwits over something as transparent as Daz's effective but greedy monopolist business strategy or the "drift of Poser into irrelevance" as part of Smith Micro's tumbling share price.

As a customer I just hate getting ripped off, and have lost patience with Poser, Daz, Smith Micro, and the whole "My program is better than your program" rubbish.

I also think it is interesting that very often apologists who applaud a company for being corporately effective in establishing a monopoly and believe the hype they are told about this being better and brighter, bigger and bolder, become the first in the queue to complain when as a result the price goes up, and they are forced to buy new stuff again and again due to "product development". Windows anyone?

Response clipped for brevity.

I also think it is interesting that very often apologists who applaud a company for being corporately effective in establishing a monopoly and believe the hype they are told about this being better and brighter, bigger and bolder, become the first in the queue to complain when as a result the price goes up, and they are forced to buy new stuff again and again due to "product development". Windows anyone?

Statistics are always going to be a more reliable indicators than a single personal opinion, any time of day. People seem to hold up quite strangely the ideal that " I don't believe your statistical facts because I have X Y Z strong opinions, which refute those statistics". Opinions very rarely in anyway are a strong stance against statistics. It's like saying 50% of people who smoke will die of a smoking related disease. "What rubbish I have smoked for 30 years and I am absolutely fine, Cough, hack cough". The personal opinion doesn't override the statistical fact, except in the mind of the individual. Is the opinion a fact or just a way of mitigating the facts in the individuals mind? Of course the points I raised help to demonstrate which system is in growth and which is in decline, to not see that trend would be purely excluding fact based on your own personal opinion. Notice nowhere in my post did I say DS is more popular because "I" this or that. Every point has a traceable data path. Maybe you can point to some data that indicates that any of my points are not the case?

Website Activity, has this actually changed? Yes there has been a clear downward trend on Poser related sites and upwards trends on Daz3D own site. Check the data yourself it's clear the volume of traffic has been swinging. Again no "I" or Opinion just data trends.

Industry Activity: Why should DAZ3D bend over backwards to keep Poser support for their content. When a) It's a small percentage of overall sales and b) Smith Micro will not lift a finger to build in support to the largest content provider on the market and will or cannot produce it's own content to a comparable professional standard. If anyone is excluding Smith Micro it is Smith Micro. Again not an opinion about why or how it effect me or "I" just reference to facts.

News Feed: You missed the point if Poser is doing well why is Smith Micro doing so bad? Why is there no news about Poser if Poser is still fertile and relevant? 

Most of your post from this point is just pure opinion and not backed up by any facts at all but your own thoughts or ideals. Pure speculation and personal opinion. Which you're entitled to but it's not really a clear indication of what is happening with Poser or Daz Studio or what the majority of customers think.

Firstly look at vendor support.

http://www.daz3d.com/vendor - have a look through this list and I think you will see a vast number of vendors who have migrated from Poser V4 support to Daz Studio Genesis Support.

So there is a trend of vendor changing markets. Usually the cause for this is that they have sampled the other market and found it more viable.

Vendors still at Renderosity are offering more and more Daz Studio Support also. Renderosity is slowly adding more DS sales and support.

Now look at website activity.

Visit Alexa.com it has some rankings based on traffic.

DAZ3D - Ranked 6444 in USA ---- Daily time on site is 15mins up 30%

Smith Micro - Ranked in USA 23 037 ---- Daily TIme on Site 3mins down 12%

Renderosity - Ranked in USA 11 762 ---- Daily Time on Site 10mins down 14%

Hivewire3d - Ranked in USA 300 236...

RuntimeDNA - Ranked in USA 35 932...

If you visit each website it's quite easy to see which has the most activity in the forums and galleries too. Compare the DAZ3D Forums to any other and you will see a clear leader for activity.

Industry Activity

When the largest content provider in the sector decides to stop supporting Poser for it's latest major product generation. It's a pretty clear indicator that it has analysed its surveys and sales data and decided it is the right time to do that. Meaning that the Daz Studio market is large enough not to need Poser support to continue. Or Poser oriented sales are not of a significant volume as that will be missed.

News Feed monitoring

Try going to google news and typing in Smith Micro and Daz3D - Daz3d reveal links to industry news and recent positive happenings with the company and it's products. Smith Micro reveal a portrait of a company with a falling share price .... its lost almost %90 of it's value in 5 years from $16 a share to $1.20... Type in Poser and there is not one relevant news feed on the first page of results.

So you can say that the data is limited or biased, but that is just not the case it's from quite varied and reliable sources that reveal an overall litmus test as to the state of Poser Smith Micro and Daz3D.

Ahh statistics. I really don't see this proves anything as to what system is more popular, or the argument about "is it worth dumping thousands of dollars of investment and following the bottomless pit that is Victoria 1- 45 and moving to Studio and locking into the DAZ business model". Vendor support:

As a vendor when an industry splits for example into both betamax and VHS one has to choose to support one or both, most seem to support both, some don't, I cannot blame them. Daz has always been the No 1 place for content... they made the base figure. But the number of Vendors spread across all the independent sites has always been bigger. Daz is encouraging vendors to NOT support Poser as part of its monopoly strategy. Yes the ultimate free market... one market. Mine.

Website activity:

Has this actually changed? I used to go to Daz all the time, I don't now, I never went to Smith Micro, its site was rubbish and always has been. Spend more time in renderosity now.

Industry activity:

When the largest content provider decided it was following a pattern of just doing content to drive people to its own software in a commercially driven move to destroy competition and dominate the market, it is acting under commercial shareholder pressure in a gamble that may pay off. They want to give the customer no choice, establish a monopoly and get all the cash. Thats what drives this, not "oh we can forgo Poser income" they are saying If you want our content you MUST use Studio. OK. Fair enough. I like to pause before I run off the dollar cliff with the other lemmings.

I'm also sure that all those happy people who invested in superior Betamax products were delighted when they were told they had to have VHS. Yea it happens... we don't need to be happy about it.

News Feed Monitoring:

Poser is just a program from a big software publishing house I would not expect it to be front page news it never has been. They don't really care that much about Poser any more than DAZ cares about its customers when it brings out a new figure with all new content every 6 months then dumps it. I used poser because the Daz customer service is terrible, its approach is arrogant, and unashamedly corporatist, treating vendors and customers like faceless ants. I did not want to reward the company for its behaviour by going Studio. I'm not claiming Smith Micro is any Better. It certainly is not any worse, and once I buy Poser I am done with them.

And I had a choice.

Daz wants a Monopoly. If poser shuts down I am absolutely sure Daz will instantly lower prices, give content for free and act counter to every monopoly in history! Of course it will. Did you spot the flying pig just then?

Neither company really gives a stuff about us the customer, we are walking wallets to be conned into buying new content every week or a "major upgrade" to a bug filled program.

I just think it is a shame when we turn into partizan nitwits over something as transparent as Daz's effective but greedy monopolist business strategy or the "drift of Poser into irrelevance" as part of Smith Micro's tumbling share price.

As a customer I just hate getting ripped off, and have lost patience with Poser, Daz, Smith Micro, and the whole "My program is better than your program" rubbish.

I also think it is interesting that very often apologists who applaud a company for being corporately effective in establishing a monopoly and believe the hype they are told about this being better and brighter, bigger and bolder, become the first in the queue to complain when as a result the price goes up, and they are forced to buy new stuff again and again due to "product development". Windows anyone?

You post was very emotion and full of falsehoods... you started the fight with this thread for not any good reason, and it gets relegated here. And the words like monopoly and hype and you expect a civil discussion?  This is why the community is really split. You probably should stop feeling so entitled first of all. That's really why there's no native support of DAZ products in  Poser. But you want DAZ to make stuff for you. They did, those users didn't want it, now their content selections are reduced and now they want to cry victim and create threads proclaiming that the "Evil DAZ empire" is trying to ruin their life. Sorry it didn't happen like that, and to keep beating the dead horse is past getting old.

Once you realize that, then you'll take your issues to the software company that you've chosen to give your support to and demand they give you the content you're not getting. 

So I'll say this time:

This is is the DAZ forum. Please take your bashing back to the Poser forum if you're unhappy with the DAZ offerings.

Thanks.

Also I find your reference to the VHS and BETA format wars to be rather relevant.

Do your research and see why VHS won in the end. BETA refused to support some content that it's competitor did support.

This ultimately lead to the failure of BETA, because it didn't offer support to what the customers wanted. Sound familiar?

A platform is only as strong as it's content.

There is a word in the english language that means, A false belief held despite strong evidence against it.

The word is delusional...

"Daz wants a Monopoly."

I'm going to call BS on that one. Studio moving to an industry standard makes it perfectly feasible for SM to implement that industry standard into poser. In other words this move is the exact opposite of trying to have a monopoly on what programs can use the figure. It is in SM's hands if they want to add that standard however.

Most of your post from this point is just pure opinion and not backed up by any facts at all by your own thoughts or ideals. Pure speculation and personal opinion. Which you're entitled to but, it's not really a clear indication of what is happening with Poser or Daz Studio or what the majority of customers think.

I must apologise for having a opinion... even if its not strictly opinion in my opinion. Historically all this is fact, I'm not disputing your stats. I'm not arguing for and against, although you assume I am. I don't care which is rising and falling. I'm not proving anything as to which is better or worse. I'm not arguing for a majority, I merely don't think your stats prove anything about what the majority is really doing/thinking either. For example Renderosity Vendors just started supporting G1 when that stopped, they have just started supporting G2... along comes G3... I know vendors who are saying "I'm going back to V4". Thats obviously the opinion of a few vendors. A lot of vendors I know were shocked by V7 when they were told about it months ago, as they were just beginning to bring out V6 stuff... this has therefore slowed some other releases on Renderosity as vendors wonder what will happen. This has happened before when G1 and G2 came out... but thats opinion obviously. Of course as monopolies establish they get more traffic... your stats seem to indicate we are heading for a monopoly. (Sorry that may be opinion again). If I produce something that no longer works with something else you have no choice but to come to me... that will drive up my traffic. Yea, makes commercial sense. I will give you iTunes for free you pay for content. The Genius there was... I did not have to change to an apple PC and I did not have to re-buy all my CD's, and re-download my music every 12 months and pay for it again. Apple is bigger than Microsoft now in the stockmarket listing (rare fact among a sea of opinion).

Both companies Smith Micro and Daz, in my opinion (Ha Ha!) are as bad as each other except in this one area.

Daz wants to establish a monopoly... thats a fact is it not? Look at the evidence. V7 and a lot of new content works in Studio only. It makes corporate sense and Daz has been following this path for months...years. That is not saying Studio it is better not saying its worse than Poser. Just a fact. Is that opinion, sorry I'm confused... must come with age?

I am concerned by this. As a rule Monopolies are not good for the consumer.

I am concerned for the future, not the past. I am concerned for the hobby, I am concerned for the vendors who get pushed to one side and make little money from their work as it is, due to an effective duopoly of distribution.

I'm sure Daz will be much much much more generous if they become the only game in town, in my opinion, the boss of Daz will of course give up his new Merc to share the spoils! That's corporate america at its best!

I know all this fluff and nonsense does not matter, just when we give someone a monopoly, and it is we the consumer that does it, let us be conscious of what we are doing and aware of the potential consequences?

As Khory_D said above if Daz3D are interested in forming a Monopoly why are they adapting industry standard formats? In fact it's probably easier to prove Smith Micro would be more interested in a monopoly than Daz3D. I have heard personally from a number of Daz3D staff members that they would love Poser to come on board with the progression of the tech. What do SM have to say about the same subject? Daz3D isn't excluding SM, SM is falling behind the entire industry.

Also I'd be interested in seeing a reference or name of a vendor who is going to move back to V4 support only? And how will customers feel about the realisation that V4 is maybe as good as it is ever going to get for Poser users.

"Daz wants to establish a monopoly... thats a fact is it not? Look at the evidence. V7 and a lot of new content works in Studio only"

V7 uses Dual Quaterion skinning, that's used in 3DS Max, Maya, softimage, and i found it in Modo too (have to try that out)... instead of just DS only, so you're incorrect on that as well. The things under the hood were done so that they work in more programs other than DS, so that doesn't sound like a monopoly to me. 

There's very few industry standard anything in Poser like the size obj files need to be imported, the offsets used in displacement maps, and even when they use open tech, such as the Pixar subdivision, the implementation is incomplete. Why? probably to get you to buy the next version of poser for that lock in. 

Sorry, but your post just reeks of sour grapes. I'm sure if Poser had all this stuff and DS didn't you'd be telling us that SM is just running a business not that they're an evil empire. 

As Khory_D said above if Daz3D are interested in forming a Monopoly why are they adapting industry standard formats? In fact it's probably easier to prove Smith Micro would be more interested in a monopoly than Daz3D. I have heard personally from a number of Daz3D staff members that they would love Poser to come on board with the progression of the tech. What do SM have to say about the same subject?

Also I'd be interested in seeing a reference or name of a vendor who is going to move back to V4 support only? And how will customers feel about the realisation that V4 is maybe as good as it is ever going to get for Poser users.

Good point... is that an opinion? How is Smith Micro forming a monopoly... just interested. Are the industry standards for which what industry? Does that mean we can go to someone else to buy Daz Studio and V7? Historically SM have been tied by being loyal to customers who have invested in content and that can obviously impact on future development by ensuring backwards compatibility. Of course if you can get everyone to buy completely new content every couple of years thats not a problem.

I'm not going to blag vendor names here. They exist ok... just look at Biscuits comment above.

I actually think V4 is very good. In my opinion. And I hope as has been the case throughout V5/6/and now 7 she will still be supported. I have just bought a brand new texture for her... when was the last new texture for Genesis? Her ongoing popularity should indicate something.

I struggle to see the benefit of V7. Sure she has an anus but I can live without that. I also like the figures to have clothing that looks like she stepped out of an office rather than a strip joint and it normally takes a year or so before that appears as it just has for the now dead V6. So do I want to throw out all my content and $1,000's of dollars of investment to "upgrade" to a new program to run V7 costing more $1000's. Not unless I really have to, and I am not alone.

Okay Poser monopoly? Here goes.

Daz3D sells content right, if Poser can use the content too, that's awesome, more sales for Daz3D. Right? If other players in the Industry and I mean the 3D graphics industry can use that content as well, also awesome - Win WIn Win... So in other words Daz3D would love to see V7 compatibility with Poser but not at the expense of handicapping their content output to fit an aging platform base.

SM sells software, and the best way to sell a standalone product is to minimise competition. Market Share is key to long term viability for this business model.

If SM could buy out DS and shelve it, it would be in there interest, business wise, to do so. Would it not?

Daz Studio is competition to Poser, Poser is not competition to Daz Studio again from a revenue point of view. As Daz3D doesn't generate direct revenue through Daz Studio.

So SM is intentionally not collaborating trying to force its users to use only what it's own platform supports. Which is becoming more and more niche.

IF SM are not monopolising why would they not build platform support for broader compatibility which are in fact industry standards? DS is broadening its compatibility of it's content. SM is refusing to budge why is that do you think?

Perhaps their business plan was to try to freeze Daz3D out of the market? Well this strategy which is quite monopolistic seems to be failing for them.

The point is that V7 is compatible with DS, 3DS Max, Maya, SoftImage, Modo plus more. Poser is the isolated platform not DS.

Why should it be Daz3D's responsibility to cripple their products to keep compatibility with a system that refuses to modernise? When the Poser Platform creators absolutely flat out refuse to collaborate to that end. And at Daz3D's expense of offering a broader support base to the wider industry as a whole. And at an end result of reducing capability for DS users. 

Sorry, but your post just reeks of sour grapes. I'm sure if Poser had all this stuff and DS didn't you'd be telling us that SM is just running a business not that they're an evil empire. 

I'm not sour grapes my friend. Its business. LOL! Why does concern for the hobby indicate that Daz is an evil empire? Whoo look out Apple is going to get you! When a firm follows commercial logic it does what Daz does. Whoo hoo I'm quaking in my boots. Does not mean I like McDonalds or wall mart. Poser was doing it in the past before Studio when it was the only game in town. It was then great when we could use studio as well as poser for the same content it was called called "competition" back in the day.

When you can only buy one source for content... does it really matter if it is in an industry standard in a content free zone? Let me just pop off to all the other stores you mention and buy V7 a new blouse. What I can't? Damn! a Monopoly is not based on Standards, it is based on what you can buy where. Of course V7 will work in Maya. Do you need to buy Daz Studio Maya exporter? Can you go to Maya to buy an new hat for M7?

I don't see the point in getting all dramatic when someone points out that Daz is a company... and it may not be altruistic and it may... shock horror... see us as a pile of cash who will rush to buy another pretty pixel girl... again and again and again.

Dude read your first post on this thread. Lack of drama is not one of its strong points....

Why should it be Daz3D's responsibility to cripple their products to keep compatibility with a system that refuses to modernise? When the Platform creators absolutely flat out refuse to collaborate to that end. And at Daz3D's expense of offering a broader support base to the wider industry as a whole. 

Ahh now you are on to something. Daz is better run for profit than SM without a doubt, they have decided to dump backwards compatibility and thrust forward with their "industry standard". Good now thats out the way. Are you happy that you have to dump your investment in V6 for V7 so that you can use this new standard and enjoy the bountiful plethora of content that is totally free?

Dude read your first post on this thread. Lack of drama is not one of its strong points....

I apologise... my gift for drama is obviously much higher than I give myself credit for.  I'm so excited that I get to spend more money on something that is a marginal improvement I get carried away. 

I'm sorry if I offended someones favourite corporate entity.

So that it? Thats your response? Thats the best rebuttal you have, pfft not much is it really ;)

Lol, it's not "their" standard. It is an industry standard.

The only things that I have for V6 that won't work with V7 are Genesis 2 figures shapes and skins. But guess what, I use Genesis 2 for them...

I'm just glad this isn't in the Poser Forum, it's at about this point I would be told "This is a POSER FORUM, what are you even doing here." I guess passive aggressiveness will just need to suffice for you then in this case. :) I must admit you do that quite well :)

"industry standard"

Remove the quotes. Dual quaternions skinning, expressions thru bones and UDIM are industry standards outside Poser ghetto.

Why should it be Daz3D's responsibility to cripple their products to keep compatibility with a system that refuses to modernise? When the Platform creators absolutely flat out refuse to collaborate to that end. And at Daz3D's expense of offering a broader support base to the wider industry as a whole. 

Ahh now you are on to something. Daz is better run for profit than SM without a doubt, they have decided to dump backwards compatibility and thrust forward with their "industry standard". Good now thats out the way. Are you happy that you have to dump your investment in V6 for V7 so that you can use this new standard and enjoy the bountiful plethora of content that is totally free?

No one had to dump anything to use V7. You can still use V6 or lower. You can use V6's clothing on V7. I've transferred morphs from V6 to V7. Skins won't work, but then most of the time I rather not use textures from previous generations due to stretching from changes in mesh. I'm curious why this of concern since V4 can't do any of that in Poser. V4 can't do much that Genesis does so well, hence the threads, because V4 is all you have or really have known.  SM really hasn't innovated in years, offering conversion tools because they recognize that no one is making current content for figures using their tech so you need ways of borrowing other figure's content. And if you want to pay SM for the an overpriced converter, that's really your choice.  But I don't understand why you are in the DAZ forum trying to justify SM's lack of innovation and projecting that on DAZ like it's their fault. You probably need to reevaluate that, because in the scheme of things, it doesn't matter. It's a dead horse, and it's been dead for some time. To be honest, no one really cares but you because that's how these convos work. But that's why DAZ went on about its business with its figures and you're here trying to make us believe Poser is still relevant with 10 year old figures that bend slightly better with a bunch of fixes... a figure that was also made by DAZ.

I think your time would be better spent using the other choices available if you're so anti-DAZ. You have options like Roxie or Dawn, or scarlett. If you need clothing, Vickie won't mind you borrowing a few of her pieces; but you can't proclaim your software is superior if you have to keep showing up on her doorstep.

Anyway, it's bed time for me. 

 I guess passive aggressiveness will just need to suffice for you then in this case. :) I must admit you do that quite well :)

If you read... I'm not for or against either program. I am interested in corporate greed and ensuring freedom of choice. I am interested in a major shift in the way content is being provided for poser users and the hobby in general. I'm sorry if that is not relavent to Daz users but I did not put this in the Daz thread. 

Passive aggressive! LMFAO! Look in the Mirror my friend... look in the mirror your reflection is not at all passive. Sorry if I somehow upset you.

If it makes it better. Daz is the best and they are wonderful and V7 is the best thing ever and Poser is poo...

There now you have won the discussion that was not what I was really discussing.

Have fun with V7 in Maya.

Let me mention Hitler right now. That will bring this whole sorry thread to an end

From passive aggressiveness to outright hysteria...

You want freedom of choice maybe ask SM to support industry standard formats and not cling to old formats while relying on third parties to make content for their platform. And then crying loud when content progresses past Poser compatibility levels.

No one is attacking you or Poser, you're just interpreting it that way. From what I see you started an argument about Daz Studio and V7 and well it hasn't exactly gone to plan when you are not flanked by a bunch of white knuckled Poser gripping forum bullies. Sorry if the conversation hasn't gone the way you planned it. I'm also sorry SM isn't investing in keeping Poser relevant. But that is hardly Daz3D's issue.

I'm not upset I have a bunch of new toys to play with. :)

But I don't understand why you are in the DAZ forum trying to justify SM's lack of innovation and projecting that on DAZ like it's their fault. You probably need to reevaluate that, because in the scheme of things, it doesn't matter. It's a dead horse, and it's been dead for some time. To be honest, no one really cares but you because that's how these convos work. But that's why DAZ went on about its business with its figures and you're here trying to make us believe Poser is still relevant with 10 year old figures that bend slightly better with a bunch of fixes... a figure that was also made by DAZ.

Can someone here read? I AM NOT ANTI DAZ! I did not put this in the DAZ Forum! A moderator did. I put it in the poser forum he moved it. I don't give a monkeys about Daz or SM or poser whats best what is worst. 

I am not trying to convince anyone about anything, I was interested in discussing how the industry has shifted, and what does this mean for the future. when we have another new figure so soon, that is only Daz studio compatible.

Clearly the world is now so divided by I'm daz and I'm poser that such a discussion is no longer possible.

I am concerned about the future of the hobby. Either side loosing out is not good for the hobby in general, but if one criticises DAZ ohh its terrible if one criticises SM or Poser you get shot down how sad for both platforms

Clearly with the discussion here the "hobby" is already dead.

Almost every post you made up till reverting to full on passive aggressive mode had very strong anti DAZ sentiment.

But that's okay no one is forcing you to like it. And as I have said many times there is room for both in this market segment, but SM needs to start carrying some of the weight in staying relevant.

Just relax, take a breath. Throw V4 into a temple or something :)

"From passive aggressiveness to outright hysteria... No one is attacking you or Poser, you're just interpreting it that way."

Oh? Read the above? Obviously? Thats not aggressive then.

"From what I see you started an argument about Daz Studio and V7"

Nope you did not read what I said repeatedly, you are assuming based upon the reaction of others who also took a discussion on the corporate policy of Daz to be attacking a sacred cow. I have no beef with Studio. I have no beef with V7. Clearly you missed my whole point :).

"and well it hasn't exactly gone to plan when you are not flanked by a bunch of white knuckled Poser gripping forum bullies. Sorry if the conversation hasn't gone the way you planned it."

Nope, just found myself in a bunch of white knuckled, red eyed, Daz bullies.

I'm glad you are not upset, and have fun with Daz studio and V7 both are good programs and great product. 

It doesn't make someone a bully just because they don't agree with you.

Discussion fails when one side decides that insulting the opposing side rather then addressing the issue is the most relevant course of action. Usually this happens when someone feels cornered or that there point of view isn't being heard. Or if they feel that they are losing the argument.

Just to refresh what was your point?

It seemed to be something like "oh no not another con from those greedy Daz people"? Maybe I have misread you.

Almost every post you made up till reverting to full on passive aggressive mode had very strong anti DAZ sentiment.

But that's okay no one is forcing you to like it. And as I have said many times there is room for both in this market segment, but SM needs to start carrying some of the weight in staying relevant.

Just relax, take a breath. Throw V4 into a temple or something :)

Clearly the Phrase I used about not preferring one software over another was meaningless, clearly the arguments about Poser or SM not being better than Daz were anti Daz studio. Can people not even conceptually grasp the difference between the corporate entity that is Daz and SM and the programs they produce. 

This forum is so defensive about anything that even implies that DAZ is not surrounded by a Halo that meaningful conversation goes out of the window just because people don't think corporate Daz is wonderful is lost in the red mist! Yes SM is no better! read that again! I have said it before!

Both companies are no better than the other.

Please read the following Studio is a good product, so Is Poser. One is no better than the other! Sacrilege! 

How very sad.

It doesn't make someone a bully just because they don't agree with you.

Discussion fails when one side decides that insulting the opposing side rather then addressing the issue is the most relevant course of action. Usually this happens when someone feels cornered or that there point of view isn't being heard. Or if they feel that they are losing the argument.

Just to refresh what was your point?

It seemed to be something like "oh no not another con from those greedy Daz people"? Maybe I have misread you.

Quite, can you point out when I was personally insulting to you and said you were being aggressive and hysterical? Please do, go on point it out.

Yep that was my point. Can you not get that? Sorry. Let me try again.

Corporately DAZ are following a very sensible policy of maximising profit by upgrading their product very regularly to encourage people to buy new product and spend more money. In my "opinion" the end result in the render is not huge over V4. Both look very good in Both poser and Studio. DAZ is greedy... it is a business. The boss of DAZ is not in it for the karma.

The fact that she is only Studio compatible means that you can only use her if you have studio. That means DAZ wants us to move to Studio. Of course it does... its corporate greed. And its yet another figure to get you to spend your money on when V6 was just gaining traction leaving vendors and content creators high and dry. Yea its the DAZ business model. No more content for V6 on to V7. It's business... is it not nice and all flowers and roses.

That is interesting to POSER users. I was not bashing DAZ over Smith Micro. Its corporate greed. Its business.

Should I run up the flag and say Yippee I get to spend more money! Does anyone?

This thread started in the POSER forum. A moderator moved it to this DAZ forum because some POSER user started screaming abut discussing DAZ only content in the POSER forum. Really? Sheesh.

It came here and the defensive guard came out. "He's criticising the sacred cow shame on him."

Now please Aggressive? Hysterical? Really?

M3D: They sold out by giving Poser users the middle finger in exchange for the big industry applications.  Daz has always catered to the hobbyist crowd.  Now they are ditching the hobbyist crowd for the industrial standard/big business crowd, which is also their reason for abandoning Genesis 2 on the second anniversary of its release.

While the Poser users may start it, it is not always a result of hostility (plenty of times it is due to what I consider perfectly legitimate grievances)  Then the DAZ users come in with arguments based on assumption (Poser is obsolete and dying, dudes, ands it's all Smith Micro's fault!), and some of it really comes across to me as rubbing it in their (Poser complainers and users') faces.

Many users on both sides are also at fault for feeding the trolls, and to be honest this annoys me far more than the trolls do.  Do not legitimize them by acknowledging their existence, just quietly report them for abuse.  I see this in too damn many places where a good or serious topic gets derailed, and all constructive discussion ignored in favor of responding to a single person's offensive comment(s).  You see it all across internetdom, and it always concludes with all but the troll and one other person ditching the thread, where these two remaining posters argue back and forth for 60~200 posts.

Problem is, as I see it, the Daz troublemakers are engaging in the Fallacy of Casual Reductionism-- assuming that there is a single (often simple) cause for something, when in reality, as with most things in life, there are multiple factors behind this.  I'll go over them for the umpteenth time in my next post (which might have like 5% new content : )

Wow, okay you still are labouring under a few misconceptions.

DAZ3D wants Poser users to use Genesis natively in Poser, it's actually in their interest to keep them on board, but not when they need to do all the heavy lifting and bear all the cost of implementation. DAZ3D sells content!

Victoria 7 isn't DS only, Poser just doesn't support the tech required to run the newest generation of figures produced by DAZ3D and SM are not willing at this point to address the issue. Which is an SM issue not DAZ3D

––––––––––––––––––

DAZ3D made Genesis 1 - DAZ3D offered to help SM making it native - SM said go to hell we don't need your stanking Genewhatsis - DAZ makes DSON importers at there cost so Poser user can access the content if they choose to

DAZ3D made Genesis 2 - DAZ3D offered to help SM making it native - SM said go to hell we don't need your stanking Genewhatsis 2 - DAZ makes DSON importers at there cost so Poser user can access the content if they choose to

DAZ3D makes Genesis 3 - Says you know what if SM wants to have Genesis 3 they need to update their platform.

How is that greedy, monopolistic or forcing Poser users to do anything? DAZ released two version of Genesis and bent over backwards to give access to Poser users for all of the content made for it. What did SM do to aid this? Seems like they said this is great DAZ3D can bear all of the cost of implementation and Poser will benefit from the content. Happy days!

In these forums the "sacred cow" is quite definitely Poser. I dared mention one time how it would be good if the next version of Poser would have native DSON support I was chased out of town with pitchforks. I can post the long list of personal insults that were leveled at me for mentioning this simple request, if you would like to see.

Also I never said you were aggressive I said you were behaving passive aggressively there is a large difference. As far as hysterical you mentioned Hitler in an attempt to try to close the thread, is that an example of rational behaviour?

"So V7 is a con at worst, a cash grab at best, DAZ3D is an evil corporate empire looking to squeeze out competition and bleed hobbyists dry. " Pls, You have been lurking in Rendo Poser forums too long my friend.

M3D: They sold out by giving Poser users the middle finger in exchange for the big industry applications.  Daz has always catered to the hobbyist crowd.  Now they are ditching the hobbyist crowd for the industrial standard/big business crowd, which is also their reason for abandoning Genesis 2 on the second anniversary of its release.

Their not ditching anyone, they have just stopped doing SM's work for them.

••••••••••

"DAZ troublemakers" hey? why not just trouble makers? Seems slightly loaded way of putting it.