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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2024 Mar 28 8:52 am)



Subject: BagginsBill I need your help


JB123 ( ) posted Tue, 18 March 2008 at 6:08 PM · edited Wed, 06 March 2024 at 4:21 AM

Hi BagginsBill,
I was wondering if reflected light (Color bleed) is possible in Poser6. I'll try to explain.
Say for instance you have a figure in sunlight wearing a bright red sweater and the color reflects
back into the neck of the figure.

I know your busy but if it's possible and you have time could you do a mini tut on this sometime in the future. I only have Poser6 so hopefully it can be done there.


replicand ( ) posted Tue, 18 March 2008 at 6:40 PM · edited Tue, 18 March 2008 at 6:45 PM

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2217752&page=1 

you could connect a gather node to the receiving material (in alternate diffuse?) and enable raytracing. You'd have to up the samples (on the node) to get a smooth look  and it may take a while to render.

$0.02


momodot ( ) posted Tue, 18 March 2008 at 9:43 PM · edited Tue, 18 March 2008 at 9:44 PM

I have used an IBL light with a plain color for the map at a low intensity. Mainly I use this for color complement shadow effect.

A crude cheap way of dealing with it is a colored light for a "shadow fill" or a tiny touch of color  in the ambient color of the object. I have long wanted a script for setting ambient nodes to a certain color along with plugging the surface texture map in as well to fake ambient light.



byAnton ( ) posted Tue, 18 March 2008 at 11:41 PM

See this thread. This part of it may be what you mean.

-Anton, creator of Apollo Maximus
"Conviction without truth is denial; Denial in the face of truth is concealment."


Over 100,000 Downloads....


vince3 ( ) posted Wed, 19 March 2008 at 5:09 AM · edited Wed, 19 March 2008 at 5:10 AM

that was a clever bit of linkin' there Anton!!

i can link to a page in a thread no probs, but how did you link to a particular message within that page?

i will start my head scratchin' now, and wear my confused face too!!! ...i might even tap me fingers on me chin for a bit, and make some "hmmm" noises aswell.


bagginsbill ( ) posted Wed, 19 March 2008 at 10:34 AM

Hi all. I'm "on the road" and can't do Poser demo renders or material screen shots. So you'll have to settle for words today. Which means this is going to get wordy.

JB: I saw a post on CP about this yesterday, and speculation that I could help. Was that you? Yesterday I was working on a tutorial about this, because I saw the question over there. If that was you, let me know so I don't bother answering in both places.

So my first thought, same as replicand, was the Gather node.

Gather is like a blurry reflection, but limited by distance. It is similar in behavior to the Ambient_Occlusion node. What both do is shoot out some semi-random rays in a cone, starting from the point being rendered. When these rays hit nothing, they do nothing. When the rays hit something, the nodes perform a calculation, based on how far the ray travelled and the angle of the ray with respect to the normal of the surface.

The AO node assembles all the hits and returns a gray-scale darkened value in proportion to the number of hits and how close they were. The Gather node does a little more. It calls the shader for each hit point, gets a reflected color, and blends them together.

So - we should be able to use a Gather node. However, when I tested it, it generated all kinds of ugly artifacts. So I postponed my tutorial - until I figure out how to get it to stop doing weird things.

But in a nutshell: Connect a Gather to Alternate_Diffuse. Set the Alt_Diffuse color to a dark to mid gray, so as to prevent the effect from being 100% which would be too much.

Use at least 30 Samples.

Experiment with the Gather distance - and pay attention to your display units. In my system Inches, I was working with Gather distance of 300. 300 what, I don't know. I think its tenths of an inch.

If you get artifacts, too, try adjusting the RayBias upwards. Watch out - too much and you get "detachment", wherein things that are really close have no influence any more. This is bad, since it is the opposite of the intention.

On thing that might help you debug: Turn off Diffuse_Value and Specular_Value (set them to 0), temporarily. Then  when you render, you'll ONLY be seeing the results from the Gather. You should see a red glow near the sweater.

Then turn the DV and SV back on. Render again. This is when I saw artifacts - strange bright spots that did not belong, and did not actually make sense, since the Gather alone looked fine.


Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)


JB123 ( ) posted Wed, 19 March 2008 at 1:54 PM · edited Wed, 19 March 2008 at 1:57 PM

Hi BagginsBill,

Thanks for replying back. I will try that out. At least 30 samples wow. I don't think my machine or my patience will like that . I rarely render at full settings( takes too fricken long) and I think they need to be at the highest settings to get that many samples although I could be wrong on that. Artifacts Im not to concerned about . I can always postwork it if it's not too bad. I really just want a fairly rough effect of this that I can clean up later in an image editor. Looking forward to the tutorial. Whenever you can get around to it is fine. Yes that was me posting about it on CP. Im BJ there.

Thanks for the link Anton. I was aware of that thread before but had forgotten about it. Thanks
for reminding me it's on my to do list as are many other things. Probably too many lol.

Thankyou too replicand.

Cheers,
JB or BJ


JB123 ( ) posted Wed, 19 March 2008 at 2:11 PM

Quote -
On thing that might help you debug: Turn off Diffuse_Value and Specular_Value (set them to 0), temporarily. Then  when you render, you'll ONLY be seeing the results from the Gather. You should see a red glow near the sweater.

Hmm If I did this would it decrease rendertime? Probably not but If so Im thinking maybe I could do two renders save them as png's and composite them together in photoshop.


bagginsbill ( ) posted Wed, 19 March 2008 at 8:16 PM

30 samples doesn't take that long to render. I was doing test renders with just James (the clothed figure, changed his shirt to red), about 600 by 400 in size, and it was less than a minute to render.

Rendering with DV=0 and SV=0 won't save any time. Even if it did, compositing in post would be impossible - you need to add the Gather effect, so you'd have to make everything else BLACK in order not to double it, which then would make it Gather nothing at all.


Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)


byAnton ( ) posted Wed, 19 March 2008 at 11:28 PM · edited Wed, 19 March 2008 at 11:30 PM

Quote - *that was a clever bit of linkin' there Anton!!

i can link to a page in a thread no probs, but how did you link to a particular message within that page?

i will start my head scratchin' now, and wear my confused face too!!! ...i might even tap me fingers on me chin for a bit, and make some "hmmm" noises aswell.*

You can link directly to lots of things. This is how you link to a specific response.

This is the base part of all forum links...
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?

Then we have this part after......
thread_id=2714444&page=3#message_3085610

This is the thread you are in.
***thread_id=2714444


This is the page of the thread you are linking to....
&page=3

And this is the message number. When you quote someone you get a message number you can use.....
***#message_3085610


-Anton, creator of Apollo Maximus
"Conviction without truth is denial; Denial in the face of truth is concealment."


Over 100,000 Downloads....


byAnton ( ) posted Wed, 19 March 2008 at 11:32 PM

-Anton, creator of Apollo Maximus
"Conviction without truth is denial; Denial in the face of truth is concealment."


Over 100,000 Downloads....


vince3 ( ) posted Thu, 20 March 2008 at 5:45 AM

cheers Anton!!

i think i get that..........a bit anyway!!

you still get to wear the "i'm officially cleverer than you" badge though. i was just wearing it for a bit to keep it warm for ya!!


vince3 ( ) posted Thu, 20 March 2008 at 5:53 AM

Whoooohooo!!!

i'm clever tooo now!!

so you get the badge weekdays and i'll keep it warm for ya on weekends.

Thanks Anton.


JB123 ( ) posted Thu, 20 March 2008 at 10:18 PM

Quote - 30 samples doesn't take that long to render. I was doing test renders with just James (the clothed figure, changed his shirt to red), about 600 by 400 in size, and it was less than a minute to render.

Rendering with DV=0 and SV=0 won't save any time. Even if it did, compositing in post would be impossible - you need to add the Gather effect, so you'd have to make everything else BLACK in order not to double it, which then would make it Gather nothing at all.

Yeah I see what you mean about compositing is no good here ( didn't occur to me at the time). I did a gather-test render yesterday with 30 samples and final render settings and it took about 15 mins.  My machines not too fast though. It took about 5 min with just primitives thrown together to look like a head and neck and a shirt. 15 min is a-ok with me but if I had a full scene that takes an hour or more I think I'll pass on it. I need to play with this some more thanks for helping out I really appreciate it. :)


bagginsbill ( ) posted Fri, 21 March 2008 at 8:04 AM

By the way, the effect is very minor, if done correctly. The fact is that your primary lighting is so wrong anyway in Poser (lack of GI in general) that the minor errors in local lighting color are dwarfed.

If you're really enthused about a "redneck" - add a small spotlight, set to very low red. It will look pretty much the same, and it will NOT take an hour to render :)


Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)


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