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 Subject: Bow Wave Using DCG Terrain Tools

bwtr opened this issue on Jan 06, 2009 · 33 posts

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  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 6:37PM Tue, 06 January 2009 

Back in about Jan07 there was some stuff/tutes, about using TerrainTools to  create a "surf" on an "invisible" triangular object to resemble bow wave effects on a boat.

Appreciate any help in locating that forum thread.---wherever it was?



  MarkBremmer    ( ) ( posted at 8:40PM Tue, 06 January 2009  · @3363065

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 9:50PM Tue, 06 January 2009  · @3363095

Thanks Mark.



  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 5:35PM Wed, 07 January 2009  · @3363624

Like Evinrude in that thread, I just can not seem to get it to work--though I feel sure I have in the past!

Did you, or anyone, get it to work?--have a shader setup to help me?

Having a thick day--again!



  MarkBremmer    ( ) ( posted at 6:22PM Wed, 07 January 2009  · @3363652

 No worries,

It's a little counter-intuitive. Here's a sample that I slapped together. Click the image for a larger view.

What you can't see in the screen capture is the vertex object that is actually in the shape of the wake. This has it's visibility turned off. 

The shader for the wake is a multichannel mixer that combines two water shaders using the Terrain>intersect function. You can see the object "wake", which is the vertex object, as the shape that the Terrain Tools function is tracking to blend the two shaders together. 

Then I just added some noise to the blend function and additionally created an irregular fall-off in the plug-ins dialog box. (you just have to click on the button for custom falloff)

Just post back with any questions.

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 7:17PM Wed, 07 January 2009  · @3363673

What a great quick response.

I printed out that  screen grab image to study---I think I am even more(very thickly) confused!

Stuff shown that is different /contrary to earlier "explanations"?

Do you have the time, using simple models would be enough, to provide a full .car file that one could study?

Could it be an addition to the brilliant "Dark Arts"?


ps  My question derived from trying to help a thread at the DAZ forum--you have no idea at how frustrated I am at the moment because I am positive I "solved" this once before!


  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 5:49PM Thu, 08 January 2009  · @3364416

Here is the original .cbr file I used back in ?2007--with my original wake test I presume--and it seems quite similar to yours.

For the life of me I can not fathom why the wake won't effect on the bow wave "shape"



  MarkBremmer    ( ) ( posted at 8:46PM Thu, 08 January 2009  · @3364514

 I can't read the type in the screen capture but make sure that you spell/use the vertex object name EXACTLY including capitalization. From what I can tell, it looks like everything is set up right so it's some other little goofy issue - like spelling.

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 9:33PM Thu, 08 January 2009  · @3364538


The problem was not naming but that my "shape" form was an 3DM file.

As a .obj file--NO PROBLEM!

Thanks Mark!



  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 5:30PM Fri, 09 January 2009  · @3365077

As you can see from the attached image, I have had some fun and learning.

However, in the process I have lost the particular shoreline effect I had----see previous post image.

Is there a way that I can get different , individual,effects to the Terrain and the BowWave items.?



  MarkBremmer    ( ) ( posted at 5:40PM Fri, 09 January 2009  · @3365080

Well yes, there is. Create two shaders that use the terrain tools blender: one for island and one for the boat. ;-)  

If you're using reference shaders instead of actually using a multichannel mixer, it won't be a problem - it's just an issue of range of effect.

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 6:42PM Fri, 09 January 2009  · @3365119

Thanks for the prompt reply Mark.
I have/had saved the two shaders involved into my Shader browser----and that idea was what I have been trying. (Obviously they both saved  with multi-channel)

However, I gather a "Reference Shader" is not the same as those?

(Sorry if I seem as thick as usual!)



  MarkBremmer    ( ) ( posted at 11:29AM Sat, 10 January 2009  · @3365510

 Reference Shaders are an option under the Complex Shader in the Shader tree (only available when selecting from the top level of a shader) This allows you to create a shader tree that "subscribes" to existing shaders. 

This provides for consistency across multiple implementations of, in this case, a water and a foam shader. Each one uses the same reference for water and foam but you can change the scale and objects that the master shader (the multichannel  mixer) interacts with.

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 3:11PM Sat, 10 January 2009  · @3365596

Thanks Mark.
After all these years,both C4 and C5 printed manuals as well, this one never registered before.
Will learning of Carrara ever finish?

Hopefully I will get on top of this today--it's 7.30am and I had to check for your response before I got dressed!

Great help mate.



  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 5:17PM Sat, 10 January 2009  · @3365676

I am so frustrated at my "thickness" but I have difficulties still.

I have Two individual Water shaders for applying to the Infinite Plain.

One has a Terrain tools Surf effect assigned by the Intersect to the Wake shape object.

The second shader, with a differently constructed Surf effect, is assigned to the Terrain via the Intersect.

To get the end result needed it would seem that both shaders need to be applied to the Infinite Plain at the same time?

I have been attempting to find a solution via the Reference Shader principle but I am stumped.



  MarkBremmer    ( ) ( posted at 5:35PM Sat, 10 January 2009  · @3365693

 Ha, you are so right. I totally spaced that. More coffee please. 

To remedy this, you can do the same trick but instead, make a plane (vertex or primitive) and make it a child of the boat. Then move this to be something like .01 above the infinite water plane. Just like before, you'll have two reference shaders. However, one of them should have an alpha value of zero to make it invisible so that the only thing showing is the foam.

This is a similar trick to what was done on the CG boats here to create the boat wakes: http://carrara3d.com/3d_gallery_icebr.html 

Look at the videos and  stills. 

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 6:35PM Sat, 10 January 2009  · @3365723

I did reply--perhaps I did not send properly.

Obviously, I am now as good as all that carrara3D stuff I have drooled over for years now!(HA<HA)

Hope you can put this all together for a Dark Arts so all can share Mark.
Very apprecitive.



  jcampos    ( ) ( posted at 10:01AM Sun, 11 January 2009  · @3366082


Can you post the .CAR file for your last post ?

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 3:56PM Sun, 11 January 2009  · @3366247

The .car file is above 5.5MB.
PM me with your e=mail address and happy to post.



  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 12:51AM Mon, 12 January 2009  · @3366499

Here is a VERY ROUGH example of using the Primivol (Inigoni) Plugin to enhance the look of spray coming off the bow wave.

Well--just a first quick try!



  ominousplay    ( ) ( posted at 8:27PM Mon, 12 January 2009  · @3367065

looking good - can you add this over an ocean primitive?

Never Give Up!

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 9:56PM Mon, 12 January 2009  · @3367108

Ha Ha--

It's on my list BUT, why not SHOW ME!



  ominousplay    ( ) ( posted at 10:04PM Mon, 12 January 2009  · @3367110

I don't even know how you did the first foam-wake ; )
I'm so behind the curve now...

Never Give Up!

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 10:11PM Mon, 12 January 2009  · @3367117

You need the Tute for the Terrain Tools plugin--at least!
(Play with.------learn!)

And, to show the potentials of the "Ocean" and "Primivol"!--Brian has great fun!


  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 10:44PM Mon, 12 January 2009  · @3367131

Just a very, very quick ROUGH! test to confirm that working with the Ocean primitive should not be a problem--I THINK!



  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 6:36AM Tue, 13 January 2009  · @3367258

Taking it a bit further.(And still rough/experimental)
Ocean Primitive
Terrain Tools "Bow Wave"
Primivol Bow Spray
Surface Replicator/Primivol flying ocean surface spray.

The latter shows up a bit at the top edge of the Ocean Primitive.

Still lots to learn.



  ominousplay    ( ) ( posted at 10:44PM Tue, 13 January 2009  · @3367772

Looks good - maybe the unlucky chap fell overboard.  Happens here in Alaska all the time on the fishing boats, and IF they're found later, many have their zipper down.  You don't hear that on the Deadliest Catch. 

Never Give Up!

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 11:19PM Tue, 13 January 2009 · edited on 11:25PM Tue, 13 January 2009 · @3367776

Do you REALLY! want me to add Viccy!!!!!!!-----or James?

Aaaaakkkoooooplut  he says!


ps The zipper is all part of the beginning and end of life as we know it?


  ominousplay    ( ) ( posted at 1:24AM Wed, 14 January 2009  · @3367814

here's an old one - it's okay, .  I like the shimmer on your ocean prim. - it has subtle texture on the surface.  Hey, my shoulder doesn't hurt with this new mouse : ) ... yet.  have you tried blurring objects yet to try for a water spray effect?

Never Give Up!

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 1:37AM Wed, 14 January 2009  · @3367818

Like that image mate.

WHICH New mouse?----asks Arthur!



  ominousplay    ( ) ( posted at 2:31PM Wed, 14 January 2009  · @3368135

I was referring to the new computer post and the problem I am having with my trackball mouse.  I changed to the Logitech TrackMan Wheel - thumbcontrol - and so far the tight pain between my spine and shoulder blade has eased up with I mouse around.
Thanks for the tip.

Never Give Up!

  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 12:48AM Sat, 17 January 2009  · @3369610

Here are some Bow/Stern wave .ob files that maybe be helpfull to use?
Just an idea, not properly tested.



  bwtr    ( ) ( posted at 12:49AM Sat, 17 January 2009  · @3369611

Here are some Bow/Stern wave .obj files ideas that maybe be helpfull to use?
Just an idea, not properly tested.

pm me for the .obj file if of interest


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