Welcome to the Poser Forum

Forum Moderators:  Kendra, wheatpenny, Jules53757    Forum Coordinators:  darknewt, gmm2

Poser F.A.Q (Updated: 2019 Jan 31 1:28 pm)


 Subject: Poser Has a New Base Figure!!

stallion opened this issue on Jan 29, 2019 · 889 posts

Top of Forum Print

  crowbar    ( ) ( posted at 6:13AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345101

Im really in two minds about this. Blackhearted's images do look good but for me the problem is not so much the corneas (though there is a weird curving off shape above the eye in a couple of the product renders). The mouth area in many of the renders is the elephant in the room. The default mouth shape just doesnt look realistic. Im not saying that the face cant look realistic if you work on more morphs, but you have to work against the basic nature of the figure


  Blackhearted    ( ) ( posted at 7:29AM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 7:31AM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345107

crowbar posted at 6:50AM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345101

Im really in two minds about this. Blackhearted's images do look good but for me the problem is not so much the corneas (though there is a weird curving off shape above the eye in a couple of the product renders). The mouth area in many of the renders is the elephant in the room. The default mouth shape just doesnt look realistic. Im not saying that the face cant look realistic if you work on more morphs, but you have to work against the basic nature of the figure

Its a base figure, there are 35 different mouth/lip morphs and 8 face chips included by default that you can combine to get mouth shapes/expressions easier than any other Poser figure.

You just can't please everyone. If I made ultra-defined, stylized lips then people would be complaining about that. No matter what design decision you make there's always someone that's going to complain that it's not to their tastes. FFS my HD morphs are like a 140lb crossfit athlete and you have some chronic complainers using the 'anorexic' word again πŸ™„

I specifically had to hold back and keep the default body and face as 'neutral' and smooth as possible so that it would be easy to morph in any direction -- not just the direction I would go with it. Not everyone likes my style of figure, and believe me you wouldn't want that baked into the base since you'd have to de-morph that any time you wanted to morph the figure. With certain legacy figures the default shape is so distinctive and so baked-in that even after extreme morphing you can still 'see' it under the surface.

The ball is in the community's court now to create characters suited to different tastes. We even made the built-in morphs and textures fully redistributable so it's even easier to create characters. I'll definitely be making more morphs and characters, but those will be going in a direction I decide and I can guarantee those won't be to everyone's tastes either.



  grichter    ( ) ( posted at 7:43AM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 7:56AM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345108

I really appreciate all the deep thought and the time expended by the developers of LaFemme

(soapbox on)

Regarding the nit-picking, No product developer of any product from software, to any retail product, to a poser figure, can anticipate all the various uses and setting combinations of any new product they create. In my lifetime I have created hundreds of mechanical products that have endured for over 40 years. Most if, not all have been revised over time based on customer feed back. How many updates have been released to fix problems for either the operating system or the web browser you are using to read this thread? Lots!

In the Poser world the most popular figure in recent times is V4. I think some of you are all forgetting there was the original Victoria 4.0. Then version 4.1 . Followed by version 4.2. We as a group didn't cast Victoria 4.0 aside because of flaws discovered that Daz didn't know of when Victoria 4.0 was released. And again even when 4.1 was released. We pointed out the flaws and waited for Daz to react.

Going back to the mechanical products I have developed over the last 40 some odd years, I craved constructive criticism.

There is a motto that goes something like this. You can please most of the people some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time.

I am not a fan of Studio's interface at all. My hope is that the clothes, shoe, hair and character product developers get behind LaFemme and that causes a resurgence of the popularity of Poser. And that the product developers behind LaFemme react to constructive criticism and improve her in ways they did see or know about on the day she was released.

Very few if any products as complex as a 3D character are ever prefect on initial release. If they were there would never have been V4.1 or V4.2.

(soapbox off)

Gary

"Those who lose themselves in a passion lose less than those who lose their passion"


  Varnayrah    ( ) ( posted at 8:03AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345112

Thank you all for your advice on render settings, it's highly appreciated! I think I have now a good balance between acceptable speed and quality as base settings I can work from for more specific needs. Else... I really think LaFemme all over is generic enough to have a really good base figure, one that can be an athlete or a tiny fairy or whatever. Her base form is perhaps more on the model side (=not as realistic as evolution), but than I really like the variety in my runtime. And I've only started scratching at the surface of all her possibilities. Way to soon to start moaning lol So thank you for bringing her into being - I really really hope that she gets lots of support even when the first excitement is worn out. About the lips - the shape is nice, I think, and can be morphes easily to liking. What I don't like sometimes is when the lips asge appears to sharp on the texture without blurring or fading the edges a bit. But that's a matter of texturing, not the base figure.


  Blackhearted    ( ) ( posted at 8:33AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345116

Varnayrah posted at 8:11AM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345112

About the lips - the shape is nice, I think, and can be morphes easily to liking. What I don't like sometimes is when the lips asge appears to sharp on the texture without blurring or fading the edges a bit. But that's a matter of texturing, not the base figure.

I think that's often more a case of the lip material zone having a different shader, or the texturer making a sharp transition from the lip:face materials. I actually wanted to make the lip and face materials one continuous material zone and include a variety of lip masks (with proper edge transitions) in case someone wanted to do a different gloss lip shader, for example... but I was voted down and we went with the traditional separate Lip material zone. Imagine how many people would be complaining now if we went with my idea? πŸ˜‰



  Varnayrah    ( ) ( posted at 8:54AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345121

Rather not lol Yes, maybe it's in the material settings, but sometimes I notice on textures, too, that the lip's edges are too sharp. That's not La femme-specific, mind you. Can happen with any base figure. But that's easily to be dealt with, so no complaint from me about the base figure there! Really, I am grateful that she's there. And it seems I shouldn't type English when having the flu. I shudder before all the typos I can't edit out any more.


  Glitterati3D    ( ) ( posted at 10:02AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345128

Blackhearted posted at 10:12AM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345116

Varnayrah posted at 8:11AM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345112

About the lips - the shape is nice, I think, and can be morphes easily to liking. What I don't like sometimes is when the lips asge appears to sharp on the texture without blurring or fading the edges a bit. But that's a matter of texturing, not the base figure.

I think that's often more a case of the lip material zone having a different shader, or the texturer making a sharp transition from the lip:face materials. I actually wanted to make the lip and face materials one continuous material zone and include a variety of lip masks (with proper edge transitions) in case someone wanted to do a different gloss lip shader, for example... but I was voted down and we went with the traditional separate Lip material zone. Imagine how many people would be complaining now if we went with my idea? πŸ˜‰

Everyone who I individually talked to missed the head morphs completely until I reminded them to use them.

La Femme comes with a great deal to play with and get to know, with just the base morphs. Add in Deecey's and Blackhearted's morph sets and you could be spinning dials for days already!

As for her mouth, I like the default shape and size. I don't care for her mouth in the Smile morphs unless I dial in some of the face chips with them - make her eyes smile, make her cheeks respond to the mouth movement. No more "dead eye" models smiling. I am anxiously awaiting some expression poses - I just suck at posing and am lazy so I'll be happy to add them to my growing La Femme collection.

Overalls2.jpg


  operaguy    ( ) ( posted at 10:08AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345129

Animation of a La Femme character with Rosemaryr's dynamic top ....

It's a slo-mo of her "getting ready for some football."

Click here for animation, 2.5MB

Thanks for your generous gift of mesh, Rosemaryr!

::::: Opera :::::


  operaguy    ( ) ( posted at 10:38AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345132

I feel that anyone criticizing the default of any model has the responsibility of posting one or more of their renders, showing the unique character they created by spinning dials. And then they should make a freebie of their great face morph.

::::: Opera :::::

res.jpg


  randym77    ( ) ( posted at 11:32AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345137

The chips take some getting used to if you're accustomed to V4 and her ilk. I was really confused at all the props that load with this figure, and didn't have a clue what they were for. (I guess I should have read the instructions.) That's probably why people think there aren't many morphs.


  Deecey    ( ) ( posted at 11:49AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345138

randym77 posted at 12:48PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345137

The chips take some getting used to if you're accustomed to V4 and her ilk. I was really confused at all the props that load with this figure, and didn't have a clue what they were for. (I guess I should have read the instructions.) That's probably why people think there aren't many morphs.

Actually, look in the Pose folder. There are face and body morph injections for La Femme in there. Over 140 face morphs, and 23 basic body morphs. In general, use the face chips for expression and animation, and use the face MORPHS for character development.



  Deecey    ( ) ( posted at 11:51AM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345139

operaguy posted at 12:50PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345132

I feel that anyone criticizing the default of any model has the responsibility of posting one or more of their renders, showing the unique character they created by spinning dials. And then they should make a freebie of their great face morph.

::::: Opera :::::

res.jpg

NIce! Face morphs are always fun to use in small increments to combine together for new characters.



  ZigZag321    ( ) ( posted at 3:22PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345151

Man, she becomes an obsession fast! And oh my God does she bend.

Time hasn't permitted me to start doing scenes with her yet and I still have to buy the morph packages, but I got to play with some dials.

Very unique and beautiful! Super fun!

FireFly render .....

0006.jpg


  Deecey    ( ) ( posted at 3:49PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 3:55PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345157

Nice! She reminds me of Ma Farrow in her younger years.



  randym77    ( ) ( posted at 4:03PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345159

Deecey posted at 4:02PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345138

randym77 posted at 12:48PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345137

The chips take some getting used to if you're accustomed to V4 and her ilk. I was really confused at all the props that load with this figure, and didn't have a clue what they were for. (I guess I should have read the instructions.) That's probably why people think there aren't many morphs.

Actually, look in the Pose folder. There are face and body morph injections for La Femme in there. Over 140 face morphs, and 23 basic body morphs. In general, use the face chips for expression and animation, and use the face MORPHS for character development.

Thanks, Deecey. I did find the injectable morphs, but it wasn't clear to me what the difference was.


  bantha    ( ) ( posted at 4:28PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345161

image.png Tempesta's textures, face morph by me. I like her, although the expressions are very different, need to practice more.

Great work, thanks to everyone envolved.


A ship in port is safe; but that is not what ships are built for.
Sail out to sea and do new things.
-"Amazing Grace" Hopper

Avatar image of me done by Chidori

  DalekSupreme    ( ) ( posted at 4:34PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 4:39PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345163

I wish La Femme well.

For me she is overly complex with horrible plastic Barbi legs and feet. She takes far too long to do simple work with and is a nightmare to pose realistically... finding the bits through endless menu's and then having to fiddle with each lip or eyebrow end. If you want to spend hours and hours on a single image she is great and her level of minute movement detail amazing. I was really hoping for something that would blow me away. Well she does... but not in a good way for me personally. She is already in the "unusable box" and that's not good. This is one of the problems with new poser figures. They are totally over complex and not simple to use. The number of times I need to bend her little toe is once in a blue moon... what I need is a single dial to make her smile lopsided not freeky. This is what brings me back time and again to V4. I can do in 10 minutes what takes me 10 hours in other figures with no improvement in result.

For me its back to V4 as La Femme is totally unworkable in my workflow. :( I am genuinely sad about this.


  xocxoc    ( ) ( posted at 5:11PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 5:14PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345168

Been playing with her this afternoon. One of my favorite poser scripts is D3D Perfect Skin SSS Lite, which makes Superfly renders faster and better. If you use this script, too. Edit "Perfect Skin SSS.fig" and add the following lines: in the [!!!MATERIAL!!!] section add: lafemme1 = lafemme in the [!!!NAME!!!] section add: lafemme = La Femme then add the following lines at the bottom: [lafemme] skin = Lips SkinHead SkinLimbs SkinTorso nail = Fingernails Toenails mouth = Gums InnerMouth tongue = Tongue teeth = Teeth eyewet = InnerEye pupil = Pupil eye = Iris sclera = Sclera cornea = EyeSurface trans = Eyelashes ( = line break)

I noticed right away that the eyes and mouth seem big on the default model, I don't really have a problem with this as it helps demonstrate the face controls, and the included sliders can adjust this. Hint: If you like larger pouty lips, select each of the 6 control nodes on the lips and set the y-scale to 125%.

The biggest noticeable flaw that can't be fixed yet is the armpits. Generally when you bend the arms to the side, there shouldn't be a gap in the armpits.

lafemme.jpg



  wolf359    ( ) ( posted at 5:17PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 5:17PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345169

Animation of a La Femme character with Rosemaryr's dynamic top ....

Looks like the figure animates easily enough ( commons sense rigging no doubt),

poser really needs a new IK foot pinning system to avoid that foot sliding :-(.

I bet she would really shine in Iclone Pro with our Maya human IK system and the ability to imbed procedural animation within a figure for easy right click retrieval and mixing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55kIU2DCk3o&feature=youtu.be



MY WEBSITE

MY IMDB LISTING




  Blackhearted    ( ) ( posted at 5:18PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345170

DalekSupreme posted at 4:44PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345163

I wish La Femme well.

For me she is overly complex with horrible plastic Barbi legs and feet. She takes far too long to do simple work with and is a nightmare to pose realistically... finding the bits through endless menu's and then having to fiddle with each lip or eyebrow end. If you want to spend hours and hours on a single image she is great and her level of minute movement detail amazing. I was really hoping for something that would blow me away. Well she does... but not in a good way for me personally. She is already in the "unusable box" and that's not good. This is one of the problems with new poser figures. They are totally over complex and not simple to use. The number of times I need to bend her little toe is once in a blue moon... what I need is a single dial to make her smile lopsided not freeky. This is what brings me back time and again to V4. I can do in 10 minutes what takes me 10 hours in other figures with no improvement in result.

For me its back to V4 as La Femme is totally unworkable in my workflow. :( I am genuinely sad about this.

The funny thing is, you don't have to even use the body handles, there are over 140 face morphs included in the base. You can turn the body handles off and completely ignore them and they don't 'hurt' you for being there. But being able to grab an eyebrow, a corner of a lip, a chin and just drag it around to do quick expressions is a lot easier than injecting morphs, looking for dials and spinning them. When doing poses you can just move the breast handle around to 'squish' it behind an arm, against the ground or chair, etc which makes realistic poses a lot easier.

Same goes for the toes. If you don't want to pose them individually then just... don't? There's no need to pose the toes individually, but they're there as an option for those that do.

Most people want more control and are embracing the body handles and extra articulated bits like the metatarsals/metacarpals, individual toes, etc. But if that's not your thing there are several different toespread, toecurl, grasp, fingerspread, etc morphs that you can use and you don't have to fuss with them.

As for the feet being too small, all I can say is that some people have been looking at V4 for too long and start to think that that represents an average normal human being. V4's feet are an abomination, they're the size of flippers. But guess what? SCALING WORKS - for the first time properly in a Poser figure. So if you don't like the size of her feet (or the size of her head, her ears, her shins, etc), click on them and scale them to whatever size you like and conforming clothing will scale automatically. You can give her V4's size 12 feet in two simple clicks.

For someone who 'wishes her well' you're going far out of your way to systematically bash her in at least two forums now. Virtually your entire post history consists of bashing new figures and extolling the virtues of V4. We get it, you like V4 and think that it's the pinnacle of Poser figure development: feel free to use her forever. Fortunately not everyone agrees.



  meatSim    ( ) ( posted at 5:54PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345173

I have a question: How many subdivion levels deep do the HD morphs go? If that makes sense... Or to put it differently at what subdivision level is the maximum detail gained.

Seriously loving the HD morphs.


  Deecey    ( ) ( posted at 6:18PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345174

DalekSupreme posted at 7:17PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345163

I wish La Femme well.

She takes far too long to do simple work with and is a nightmare to pose realistically... finding the bits through endless menu's and then having to fiddle with each lip or eyebrow end.

Are you using Poser 11?



  Deecey    ( ) ( posted at 6:21PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 6:24PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345175

xocxoc posted at 7:19PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345168

Been playing with her this afternoon.

I noticed right away that the eyes and mouth seem big on the default model, I don't really have a problem with this as it helps demonstrate the face controls, and the included sliders can adjust this. Hint: If you like larger pouty lips, select each of the 6 control nodes on the lips and set the y-scale to 125%.

There are over 140 face morphs in the Pose folder, as well as some basic body morphs. Use the "INJ All Face Morphs" and "INJ Body Morphs" poses to add them to La Femme. Lots of mouth and lip dials in there, as well as tons of other face morphs.



  Blackhearted    ( ) ( posted at 6:22PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345177

meatSim posted at 6:14PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345173

I have a question: How many subdivion levels deep do the HD morphs go? If that makes sense... Or to put it differently at what subdivision level is the maximum detail gained.

Seriously loving the HD morphs.

2, the default render subD level.

It jumps to around 100k polys on level 1 and 400k on level 2. 3 would be a pretty big jump to >1.5 million polys. I might try it just out of curiosity to test render speeds, but I don't think it would be worth it - Poser even starts popping up warnings at that density. That type of fine detail is for veins, tiny wrinkles, etc which would probably best be accomplished with a normal map/bump map.



  Deecey    ( ) ( posted at 6:49PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345178

randym77 posted at 7:47PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345159

Deecey posted at 4:02PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345138

randym77 posted at 12:48PM Sun, 03 February 2019 - #4345137

The chips take some getting used to if you're accustomed to V4 and her ilk. I was really confused at all the props that load with this figure, and didn't have a clue what they were for. (I guess I should have read the instructions.) That's probably why people think there aren't many morphs.

Actually, look in the Pose folder. There are face and body morph injections for La Femme in there. Over 140 face morphs, and 23 basic body morphs. In general, use the face chips for expression and animation, and use the face MORPHS for character development.

Thanks, Deecey. I did find the injectable morphs, but it wasn't clear to me what the difference was.

Think of it this way ...

Face chips are used for expressions and facial animation. Kind of like bones are.

The face MORPHS are like good old fashioned character morphs that you are used to seeing in older figures.

So use morphs for character variation and appearance, and face chips for expression and facial animation.



  meatSim    ( ) ( posted at 6:54PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345179

I'm really optimistic with this figure. I like the way you guys went about the launch. No pre-hype. Just a really good figure with some great assets available and a trusted team right out of the gate. I'm sure you are all tremendously proud of your accomplishment here and you should be.

As much as some people post history consists mostly of bashing new figures, mine probably comes across as a new figure cheerleader... But I can't help it!!
Having seen first hand how much goes into these things with the poserplace crew, I can only be greatful and appreciative of anyone who's willing and able to run that gauntlet whether the end result suits my tastes or not... In this case I think you knocked it out of the park.


  -Timberwolf-    ( ) ( posted at 7:14PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · edited on 7:15PM Sun, 03 February 2019 · @4345181

Quote by Dalek Surpreme: β€œThis is what brings me back time and again to V4. I can do in 10 minutes what takes me 10 hours in other figures with no improvement in result.β€œ

Setting up a scene and a good pose is allways complex and time consuming. Doing it in 10 min. with a limited figure like V4 seems impossible to me, when the result is suppose to be high quality. PE is a first class figure, but hard to work with. La Femme has a good balance. Not to difficult, but with good results.


  ZigZag321    ( ) ( posted at 10:09PM Sun, 03 February 2019  · @4345190

I just couldn't stop myself. LOL. When I saw what Dalek said, this idea popped into my head ....

😀

All for fun all for fun all for fun! Have a great week, everybody, and thank you so much for this awesome, super fun, beautiful figure!

0011.jpg


  Rosemaryr    ( ) ( posted at 2:12AM Mon, 04 February 2019 · edited on 2:54PM Sun, 10 February 2019 · @4345201

Content Advisory! Nudity advisory.

Anyone interested in a fairly simple corset morph? Partially dialed, partially morph brushed. Breasts moved inwards and up, waist narrowed (obviously!), hipbone crests smoothed out. Basic slender figure suitable for almost any period clothing where corsets and girdles were supreme.

CorsetMorph.jpg

RosemaryR
---------------------------
"This...this is magnificent!"
"Oh, yeah. Ooooo. Aaaaah. That's how it starts.
Then, later, there's ...running. And....screaming."
---------------------------

  DalekSupreme    ( ) ( posted at 4:33AM Mon, 04 February 2019  · @4345205

Blackhearted posted at 9:18PM Mon, 04 February 2019 - #4345170

"For someone who 'wishes her well' you're going far out of your way to systematically bash her in at least two forums now. Virtually your entire post history consists of bashing new figures and extolling the virtues of V4. We get it, you like V4 and think that it's the pinnacle of Poser figure development: feel free to use her forever. Fortunately not everyone agrees."

Actually as someone who has not posted for over 4 years due to the constant trolling and negative feedback when someone states an opinion on this site your comment about my "entire post history" is both uninformed rubbish and rude.

Yes I find her both ugly about the legs and hard work to use, and yet I hoped she would be successful. I hoped to be wrong and I did wish her well.

What I was referring to about V4 was her ease of use and commerciality. No she is not perfect. Otherwise we would not be desperately looking to replace her. If you can't take feedback about how what made V4 a success and apply it to your own creation well good luck to you.

Now I hope you enjoy spending the money I have pumped into her accessories and your products, and when you get feedback I hope you have the ability to take it on board without being rude. In the mean time good luck with your figure.

Please don't worry... I won't be buying any more of your products and I will now delete La Femme from my runtime so you wont have any more issues with me commenting in future.


 To create a post you must first sign in or register an account.

Privacy Notice

This site uses cookies to deliver the best experience. Our own cookies make user accounts and other features possible. Third-party cookies are used to display relevant ads and to analyze how Renderosity is used. By using our site, you acknowledge that you have read and understood our Terms of Service, including our Cookie Policy and our Privacy Policy.