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Poser F.A.Q (Updated: 2016 Nov 29 4:50 pm)


 Subject: NO MORE FLASH!!!!!!

mamba-negra opened this issue on Dec 12, 2014 · 48 posts

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  mamba-negra    ( ) ( posted at 10:18PM Fri, 12 December 2014 

I'm not sure how windows does it, bit Apple locks down old versions of flash whenever they discover potential vulnerabilities. There are three typical vectors of infection for Macs today: Flash, Java and users who grant random scripts super user permission (i.e. going to some bad site and then willingly typing in your password to let it install malware with administrator rights). 

Poser forces me and other Mac people to install Adobe's bug riddled crapware...about once a month. On other words, poser requires me to install one of the two primary vectors of malware. Am I the only one who finds this really irritating? Doesn't Poser already have a GUI? Can't they just ditch the flash library system and write one in Python or maybe even...whatever the rest of the GUI was written in? Do we REALLY need a webserver embedded into an already bloated application just to make life easier for the developer(s)?

Am I the only one who really wants them to switch? Is there someplace we can go to let SM know that we aren't happy with this? 


  basicwiz    ( ) ( posted at 10:53PM Fri, 12 December 2014  · @4184065

Never been a problem for me. 


  FightingWolf    ( ) ( posted at 8:22AM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184097

Questions:

  1. Do you have an anti-virus software running on your computer?

  2. Do you have a firewall running on your computer?

I only ask this because for some reason there are a bunch of Mac users who think that their computers don't get viruses. That assumption means that they don't buy antivirus software or firewall software to provide security for their computers.

Like basicwiz I haven't experienced the flash issue that you are having. It's been more than 5 years (maybe more) since I've even had malware problems of any type and the reason is because I have the extra security running on my computer and I increased my knowledge on how malware typically gets on a computer.

Poser By Design


  icprncss2    ( ) ( posted at 8:41AM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184102

To be perfectly honest with you, I have never updated either Flash or Air in all the versions and years Poser has been using them.  Back in the P8 days, SMS tech support told me to disable the auto updates.  They told me that the version of Flash or Air is adequate for the Poser's needs.  Since I have no real need for Flash or Air outside of the Poser library, I have all versions of Poser from P5 to Game Dev on my system.  This includes all the Pro versions.  Never updated Flash or Air.  Never had a problem. 

So, if the only thing Mac users need Flash or Air for is Poser, why not install the version that is part of Poser and let it go at that?


  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 9:33AM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184106

I hope they ditch it for the next release otherwise I won't be upgrading, it's an outrage it's a requirement even now.  The content browser of Poser should be coded as part of the main program like it was before, not based on some crappy dead technology that requires corporate spyware to be installed on your computer in order to use it.

Personally, once I've reformatted, there's no way the Adobe corporate spyware (AKA Flash) is getting back on my computer, so I can only hope that the next release isn't too long after that, and that they remove the need for Flash.

["NO MORE FLASH!!!!!!"

](http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro?thread_id=2886996)


  mamba-negra    ( ) ( posted at 9:41AM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184107

To be perfectly honest with you, I have never updated either Flash or Air in all the versions and years Poser has been using them.  Back in the P8 days, SMS tech support told me to disable the auto updates.  They told me that the version of Flash or Air is adequate for the Poser's needs.  Since I have no real need for Flash or Air outside of the Poser library, I have all versions of Poser from P5 to Game Dev on my system.  This includes all the Pro versions.  Never updated Flash or Air.  Never had a problem. 

So, if the only thing Mac users need Flash or Air for is Poser, why not install the version that is part of Poser and let it go at that?

I'm not entirely sure where you would get the SM flash version. When I installed poser on this new mac a couple of weeks ago, I was forced to go directly to adobe in order to use it. And now, once again just 2 or 3 weeks later. So, maybe it was installed but it was being blocked by apple. I have the same problem with Java. I have an IDE that I use that requires Java, and that version was blocked, so I had to go to oracle and download the latest version of the JVM.  Oh well. Maybe I'm the only one who finds this really annoying. 

As for anti-virus, I have been using the mac for nearly 10 years, and I have never installed anti-virus nor have I had any problems. Part of it is that there isn't as much to gain by exploiting macs (fewer numbers), but I think the general security model for unix was very mature when script kiddies started exploiting windows back in the late 90s, making anti-virus necessary. All you needed to know back then was basic, and you could write yourself a melissa virus that took down whole companies for days. 


  MistyLaraPrincess    ( ) ( posted at 10:09AM Sat, 13 December 2014 · edited on 10:10AM Sat, 13 December 2014 · @4184113

the adobe stuff came on my poser dvd, pp12 retail box version.  my pc isn't internet connected, no updates forced on me.

i do miss the poser 7 library.  actual size thumbnails, subfolders were sorted to the bottom of the folder. admittedly was slower rolleyes.gif





  Daffy34    ( ) ( posted at 11:15AM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184126

I've never had any problems either. But then I use Windows ;).

On a side note...if you have the pro version of Poser you can use Air rather than Flash. Of course, I have no idea if Air runs on a Mac, but I'm fairly sure it does :).

Laurie



  ssgbryan    ( ) ( posted at 11:30AM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184130

I'm not sure how windows does it, bit Apple locks down old versions of flash whenever they discover potential vulnerabilities. There are three typical vectors of infection for Macs today: Flash, Java and users who grant random scripts super user permission (i.e. going to some bad site and then willingly typing in your password to let it install malware with administrator rights). 

Poser forces me and other Mac people to install Adobe's bug riddled crapware...about once a month. On other words, poser requires me to install one of the two primary vectors of malware. Am I the only one who finds this really irritating? Doesn't Poser already have a GUI? Can't they just ditch the flash library system and write one in Python or maybe even...whatever the rest of the GUI was written in? Do we REALLY need a webserver embedded into an already bloated application just to make life easier for the developer(s)?

Am I the only one who really wants them to switch? Is there someplace we can go to let SM know that we aren't happy with this? 

Yes, you are the only one who wants them to switch.  Yes, you can go to SM's site & let them know that YOU are unhappy with it.  Don't presume to speak for the rest of us.
The chances of SM changing it are effectively zero, but if it makes you happy, knock yourself out.



  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 11:37AM Sat, 13 December 2014 · edited on 11:42AM Sat, 13 December 2014 · @4184131

I hope you're wrong, cause the chances of me buying another copy of Poser are also zero unless it becomes independent from Adobe components.
Poser wasn't dependent on that junk before, and shouldn't need to be now.


  ssgbryan    ( ) ( posted at 11:55AM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184136

I am not - SM rewrote the entire code base.  "That Junk" is why we have the add-on framework and access to everything that has been added to it. 



  WandW    ( ) ( posted at 12:05PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184137

The reason they went to the webkit Library interface is that they can use the same code across multiple products and platforms.  Bagginsbill did the coding...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Wisdom of bagginsbill:

"Oh - the manual says that? I have never read the manual - this must be why."

“I could buy better software, but then I'd have to be an artist and what's the point of that?"

"The [R'osity Forum Search] 'Default' label should actually say 'Don't Find What I'm Looking For'".


  basicwiz    ( ) ( posted at 12:31PM Sat, 13 December 2014 · edited on 12:32PM Sat, 13 December 2014 · @4184140

"I hope you're wrong, cause the chances of me buying another copy of Poser are also zero unless it becomes independent from Adobe components."

Promise? (ROFL)


  hornet3d    ( ) ( posted at 12:59PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184142

 I have been using Poser for over 10 years now, don't know at which point they started with Flash and Air mainly because I have never had a problem.  I have updated them in the past but it has never been an issue for me.  Once again I am on Windows so perhaps that explains it.

 

 

I use Poser Pro 2014 on Windows 7 - Set up is a quiet running PC thanks mainly to a Fractal design F4 case and 6 large fans, a Seasonic 850w X-series PSU.  Setup is Intel i7 3770k, Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UP5-TH with 60G m-sata to accelearate one 1TB Hard drive, Gigabyte 2Gig 7850 and 32Gig ram (6X2).  Storage is 1 X 180G SSD, 1X 2Tb Samsung Ecos + 2 X 1tb Spinpoint F3s.


  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 1:00PM Sat, 13 December 2014 · edited on 1:01PM Sat, 13 December 2014 · @4184143

I know Baggins did the coding, I stumbled upon that the other day, but it's not the coding I have an issue with, it's the use of "Flash" I have an issue with because I don't see why I should have to install corporate spyware from Adobe on my computer, in order to use Poser.  I would never have purchased Poser 10 in the first place if I'd known Flash was required to actually use the program, it's normally only requred for Flash exports, not to form one of the main features of the program!

And mean for crying out loud, Flash of all things!
Flash is dead, and even when it was in it's prime (if you can call it that), it was always a festering, resource hogging pile of crap, and still is!

No "Flash" and no "Air" is getting installed on my system again, so it looks like goodbye Poser.


  Daffy34    ( ) ( posted at 1:22PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184147

Well, I guess there will be nothing to complain about then :)

Laurie



  moogal    ( ) ( posted at 1:55PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184152

If you're so bothered about having to use it now, why wait until the next version of Poser to stop?  Threats to quit using a program rarely change anything if they aren't made directly to the company.


  Daffy34    ( ) ( posted at 2:17PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184155

Good lord....

Chill.

Laurie



  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 2:24PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184156

You should try that yourself instead of trolling.
When you post unwarranted wisecracks like that, you can expect a response for it, same for Wiz.

There's a person you're aiming the wisecracks at, and they're not posted by accident.


  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 2:26PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184157

Be interesting to see if the EX Mod gets a suspension for trolling - which he clearly is doing with a comment like that!


  fictionalbookshelf    ( ) ( posted at 2:34PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184158

Please let's keep this thread civil and polite.

My Store & My Freebies

  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 2:41PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184160

Will do, fictionalbookshelf, but my god, it's pretty damn hard around here sometimes!


  shvrdavid    ( ) ( posted at 5:26PM Sat, 13 December 2014 · edited on 5:27PM Sat, 13 December 2014 · @4184187

I know Baggins did the coding, I stumbled upon that the other day, but it's not the coding I have an issue with, it's the use of "Flash" I have an issue with because I don't see why I should have to install corporate spyware from Adobe on my computer, in order to use Poser.  I would never have purchased Poser 10 in the first place if I'd known Flash was required to actually use the program, it's normally only requred for Flash exports, not to form one of the main features of the program!

And mean for crying out loud, Flash of all things!
Flash is dead, and even when it was in it's prime (if you can call it that), it was always a festering, resource hogging pile of crap, and still is!

No "Flash" and no "Air" is getting installed on my system again, so it looks like goodbye Poser.

If you do not install Flash on a new system, some things won't work. Air probably wont be that big of a deal. HTML 5 is slated to be the replacement for both, from the powers that be. And is in use with a lot of things now.. 

HTML 5 uses the websocket protocol for things like the library, which has it's own book of issues. Another issue, is what is trusted here may not be trusted anywhere else.

Commands listed as trusted in one browser may not be in another. Making code, and it wont work everywhere,... Including operating systems.

So even if an HTML 5 library is written, it will have holes in it because it is written in HTML 5..... It may also need multiple code paths just so it will work on different platforms.

Don't let this stop anyone from writing a replacement thou. As there already are more than a few of them out there.

Food for thought....

https://forum.smithmicro.com


  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 5:40PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184193

HTML 5 is fine with me, it's an open cross-platform format, has nothing to do with Adobe, and doesn't require the installation of spyware in order to use it.
I even use a HTML 5 player for YouTube, so, no problem with HTML5  here - no complaints.

Flash though, that's a different thing altogether - in more ways than one.


  FightingWolf    ( ) ( posted at 10:43PM Sat, 13 December 2014  · @4184218

As for anti-virus, I have been using the mac for nearly 10 years, and I have never installed anti-virus nor have I had any problems. Part of it is that there isn't as much to gain by exploiting macs (fewer numbers), but I think the general security model for unix was very mature when script kiddies started exploiting windows back in the late 90s, making anti-virus necessary. All you needed to know back then was basic, and you could write yourself a melissa virus that took down whole companies for days. 

10 years without an anti-virus program.   I never really understood how people without antivirus claim that their computer doesn't have a virus or could never get one.  Even worse you state that there isn't as much to gain by exploiting Macs.  Mac users have credit cards and bank accounts just like everyone else.  A target is a target regardless of what OS they are running,  The fact that many Mac users don't use antivirus software or firewall software makes you an easier target. Here's an article from 2012 Malware Infects One In Five Mac Devices: REPORT   The top malware problems that affect Macs comes from flash, but only Macs have that issue. According to the report, PC computers don't have this same issue.  In addition the report states that Mac leads the OS world for having security vulnerabilities.  I can only assume that Mac users who think their computers don't need antivirus or firewall software would have the most security vulnerabilities.

I clean malware off of computers and the majority of the malware and viruses that I find don't cause problems and the only way that anyone would know that they are there is to run a software that can detect it.  Just something to think about.

Poser By Design


  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 5:14AM Sun, 14 December 2014 · edited on 5:15AM Sun, 14 December 2014 · @4184236

Problem is, not enough people are aware that the Flash Player is corporate spyware, so not enough people are bothered about it, and you have to wonder how long it will take for people to realise that if Poser didn't depend on Flash, none of them would be having a "Flash-based" issue in the first place :-D

The Content Browser really should be integrated like it used to be, coded in whatever language the bulk of the program is coded in.


  bevans84    ( ) ( posted at 7:37AM Sun, 14 December 2014  · @4184241

Never been a problem for me as far as poser, I use D3D's XL and Shaderwork's Library Manager. The only thing I use the poser library for is to set up runtimes and sometimes to swap figures in the scene.

I do use a flash blocker in Firefox though, to keep flash ads from loading and playing automatically.



  ypvs    ( ) ( posted at 8:56AM Sun, 14 December 2014  · @4184243

 I admit to gritting my teeth every time I install a Flash update. The first thing I do after is to fire up Poser and check it all works. Me- Poser Addict????

 I'm not clever enough to replace Posers reliance on Flash or IE so I'm stuck with them. I just make sure they're up to date along with my AV and firewall. If you don't like the vulnerabilities then find software that doesn't use them- DAZ Studio or Lightwave spring to mind. The only system that will be secure is one with an air gap to the World Wide Web.

 I did have a choice to Adobe Acrobat and installed Foxit reader instead- even that has its own foibles.

 It's your choice and only you can make it

Poser 11 , 68Gb in 8 Runtimes, PaintShop Pro 9
Windows 7 HP 32 bit, Avast AV, Comodo Firewall
Intel Q9550 Quad Core cpu,  4Gb RAM, 250Gb + 250Gb +160Gb HD, GeForce GTX 650


  FightingWolf    ( ) ( posted at 1:19PM Sun, 14 December 2014  · @4184281

Problem is, not enough people are aware that the Flash Player is corporate spyware, so not enough people are bothered about it, and you have to wonder how long it will take for people to realise that if Poser didn't depend on Flash, none of them would be having a "Flash-based" issue in the first place :-D

The Content Browser really should be integrated like it used to be, coded in whatever language the bulk of the program is coded in.

  1. Every software that you get has the potential to be "corporate spyware" That's just the way things are. They make the software so they can gather any information that they want so long as they aren't stealing passwords or your personal files. Monitoring browsing habits is nothing new. Having applications communicating with the company's server is nothing new.  That's been going on for the longest.  The "corporate spyware" that you are complaining about, is the same thing that Microsoft does with all of its applications. My firewall application notifies me when any of my applications are "talking" to the server.
  2. Do you ever read the Terms & Conditions for software?  The "corporate spyware" that you are complaining about as being "corporate spyware" is stated in their terms.  Section 7.7 Please note that the Adobe Privacy Policy allows tracking of website visits and it addresses in detail the topic of tracking and use of cookies, web beacons, and similar devices. This is small in comparison of what other applications doe, For example, phone applications go way beyond this sort of tracking and information gathering.  It's not spyware if they are telling you what they are doing.  The point of spyware is to get information without you knowing. If you don't want adobe talking to the server then block it with a firewall.

But most apple users don't use security software like firewalls so blocking it may is not possible and Mac users seem to be the only ones with this issue.

Poser By Design


  pumeco    ( ) ( posted at 1:44PM Sun, 14 December 2014 · edited on 1:45PM Sun, 14 December 2014 · @4184285

Yes, I always read the label, but I shouldn't have to install Adobe spyware to use Poser.  The point is, we're having to accept spyware terms from Adobe in order to use a 3D Figure tool that has nothing to do with them.

Other than the obvious, that we're having to do so, can you give me one good reason why anyone should have to do that?

The only reason the Flash spyware had to be on installed on my system before, was to play YouTube videos, but since HTML 5, it was no longer necessary to tolorate having Adobe's spyware on my system.  Today, the only reason it needs to be there is so that I can use Poser 10, something that would never have been purchased if I'd been made aware of the need to install Adobe's spyware in order to use it.

Basically, SM need to ditch Flash, and the original poster of this thread (and myself) are perfect examples of why that is.
No Flash, no Flash problem!


  FightingWolf    ( ) ( posted at 8:26PM Sun, 14 December 2014  · @4184314

Pumeco

Sometimes the only reason you need is the obvious one.  If you want to use Poser then you have to accept any of their third party scripts that are used to operate Poser.  It's no different than any other software out on the market. The same thing that you are complaining about is done with Mac OS.  Your Mac OS tracks your behavior as well and collect more data than adobe flash. 

Washington Post Article: Apples Mac Computers Can Automatically Collect Your Location Information I

"Once Yosemite is installed, users searching for files – even on their own hard drives -- have their locations, unique identifying codes and search terms automatically sent to the company, keystroke by keystroke. The same is true for devices using Apple’s latest mobile operating system, iOS 8"

See even Apple does what adobe does and more

Poser By Design


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