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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2022 Jan 27 5:22 pm)


Subject: V4/M4 products now?


primorge ( ) posted Mon, 19 July 2021 at 2:08 PM · edited Thu, 27 January 2022 at 5:11 PM

I'm curious if people still buy character/texture sets for V4/M4, maybe asking forum regulars isn't the right demographic to ask this question of. I imagine there are a lot of lurkers who do not post. Also, are there many vendors making stuff, again character sets, specifically for those figures? I know people still probably buy clothing items and such for those figures, I do, but maybe the character set market has dried up? Just curious.


primorge ( ) posted Thu, 23 December 2021 at 10:35 AM

To be honest at this point I'm considering dumping all of these figures for projects and concentrating on props or my own figure creation. Getting exhausted messing with other peoples baked in problems and all the associated rules and hoops.


randym77 ( ) posted Thu, 23 December 2021 at 11:05 AM

I think people do still buy V4/M4 characters, but they don't pay a lot. I pay a little more for M4 characters, because they're rarer than V4. But still not much. 

I don't think there's anyone still making stuff for V4 or M4, except as a fit for an item made for another character. You see this a lot with hair or dynamic clothing. It's made for Dawn, LF, PE, but there's a fit for V4 included. 

I thought you were going to make stuff for Dawn 2?


primorge ( ) posted Thu, 23 December 2021 at 11:50 AM

I'll definitely purchase it...


(that ... contains a ton of subtext)


Y-Phil ( ) posted Thu, 23 December 2021 at 2:12 PM · edited Thu, 23 December 2021 at 2:12 PM

As I'm not a vendor (I really don't have enough free time to do it, and I'm rather convinced that I won't be good at it), I'm still using Sasha-19, the best weightmapped Vic4 I've tested till now.
I still need to practice with dynamic clothes because I often get weird results. That's why I often use 3d-age's clothes because these are the ones that provide the most morphs. That plus Posermatic's NGM, which give the best control to fill correctly cleavages.

Here is an example with which I'm having difficulties:

2ZYcqTcIyKHkPi7EiMWcuxyOEtgKj3G7oKCxhtoF.png

I wanted to use the middle-length top, and I've tried hard to let it fall around the dress, but it still interacts with it.

From time to time, I'm using LF, but it really lacks of freedom for the shapes (for example the shapes of her breasts don't convince me enough, even under clothes), and when you're used to the numerous morphs of Sasha-19, it take a far longer time to pose LF. Furthermore, I have no freedom with the shapes as I don't model.
It's the same problem with Dawn: not being a modeler equals being prisoner with what you are offered when you buy the character or a new morphology. this is somewhat frustrating, compared to the 3 packs: Morphs++, Badabing and NGM.

My personal humble opinion for what concerns customers like me: LF and Dawn are somewhat the Genesis8.x counterparts: you buy, you pose, you render. With Sasha-19 / Vic4, it's a little more tricky, but I like that.
But this does not prevent me at all from buying products for LF, on the contrary: I want to help its diffusion and to support the vendors. And I'll very probably buy Dawn2 as well, for the same reasons. At the time, I bought Dawn, its special editions, and a few specific morphs.
Not to mention the fact that I have a well-stocked wardrobe of urban and sexy styles, and it will cost a lot of money to buy the same for LF, and Dawn2. 

Speaking of hairs and cloth textures: it's been a rather long time that I don't use the default textures and materials: I'm using from time to time their bitmaps, but with personal settings, especially for the old Vic4-specific hairs, and as an hobbyist, it's really part of the fun with Poser.
And I love the fact that nowadays, we find hairs for all three characters, that's great, too.

Y-Phil.


Win10 on i7 8700K@4.3Ghz, 32Gb, GeForce RTX 2080 Ti, 2x 2Tb ssd + 1x 6Tb hd, Poser 11, Poser 12, Octane, HDR Light Studio


randym77 ( ) posted Thu, 23 December 2021 at 4:38 PM

It's the head morphs that I miss with Dawn and LF. They've gotten more (especially Dawn - she had nothing when she was first released). But still hardly anything compared to V4.

I don't really care about boobs. I like to be able to make figures look like real people. Celebrities, politicians, family members. I'm not that great with magnets or modeling; I want dials to spin.

Though I wonder if the reason V4 has so much support is just because she's so old. My employer went through a bad spell where they had no money to upgrade software or hardware. We spent something like 10 years using the same software. And it was great. Well, the slow computers weren't great, but we tweaked the software so it was perfect for us. There are tens of thousands of preferences in our main software package, and we actually had most of them set up.We've never come close to it since.

Anyway, I've tried with La Femme and find it difficult to get a likeness with her. I think she doesn't enough polys in her face or something. I find even V3 and M3 easier to work with. They have a lot of polys in their heads.


Y-Phil ( ) posted Thu, 23 December 2021 at 5:05 PM · edited Thu, 23 December 2021 at 5:07 PM

randym77 posted at 4:38 PM Thu, 23 December 2021 - #4432344

It's the head morphs that I miss with Dawn and LF. They've gotten more (especially Dawn - she had nothing when she was first released). But still hardly anything compared to V4.

I don't really care about boobs. I like to be able to make figures look like real people. Celebrities, politicians, family members. I'm not that great with magnets or modeling; I want dials to spin.

Though I wonder if the reason V4 has so much support is just because she's so old. My employer went through a bad spell where they had no money to upgrade software or hardware. We spent something like 10 years using the same software. And it was great. Well, the slow computers weren't great, but we tweaked the software so it was perfect for us. There are tens of thousands of preferences in our main software package, and we actually had most of them set up.We've never come close to it since.

Anyway, I've tried with La Femme and find it difficult to get a likeness with her. I think she doesn't enough polys in her face or something. I find even V3 and M3 easier to work with. They have a lot of polys in their heads.

Now that you're speaking of Vic3: I've been astonished by what EZSkin could do with those old characters. Rendered using P11 5 years ago:

YzmAyMcMCXZDK5ScRk0Uv6AQ1ugWtWpMbfjovtBb.png

And when I say 5 years, the morphology comes from the past, really: mid 2006 😅

Y-Phil.


Win10 on i7 8700K@4.3Ghz, 32Gb, GeForce RTX 2080 Ti, 2x 2Tb ssd + 1x 6Tb hd, Poser 11, Poser 12, Octane, HDR Light Studio


randym77 ( ) posted Thu, 23 December 2021 at 9:58 PM

Nice render!

I bought a bunch of characters for V3 and A3 during the Black Friday sale. They're so cheap, and a lot of them still look really good.  I've been using JoePublic's weightmapped V3. Too bad there's no weightmapped A3.


primorge ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 5:38 AM

"Too bad there's no weightmapped A3."

There probably is a WM A3... just too much of a PITA to make it shareable.


randym77 ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 12:30 PM

Could be. RTEncoder is kind of a pain. I've noticed DAZ no longer requires it for older products sold in their store. Like Melody for A3. Probably too much of a pain dealing with RTEncoder tech support. They haven't changed the readmes, though. I guess no one ever reads the documentation. :-D


hborre ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 1:13 PM

Doing a quick Google resulted in no hits whatsoever.  ATM, converting Aiko 3 to weight mapping remains a pipe dream, it may never get done.


primorge ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 4:04 PM · edited Fri, 24 December 2021 at 4:11 PM

hborre posted at 1:13 PM Fri, 24 December 2021 - #4432362

Doing a quick Google resulted in no hits whatsoever.  ATM, converting Aiko 3 to weight mapping remains a pipe dream, it may never get done.

I wouldn't venture to guess what some of the silent odd balls who utilize Poser in unconventional or unspeakable :D ways might have lurking in various states of completion or undress in their Runtimes... regardless of what the all seeing eye of Google has to say about it. Have you ever looked at some of the obviously frankensteined A3 version figures tucked away on some obscure Japanese sites? Granted not WM... but I haven't looked at everything everywhere.

The thoughts of those thinking inside the box very rarely effects those who are thinking in some alien blob shape, at least in private art pursuits.

I'm curious what magical combination of difficulty it is exactly that makes WM A3 such a Pipe Dream.


primorge ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 5:23 PM

randym77 posted at 12:30 PM Fri, 24 December 2021 - #4432361

Could be. RTEncoder is kind of a pain. I've noticed DAZ no longer requires it for older products sold in their store. Like Melody for A3. Probably too much of a pain dealing with RTEncoder tech support. They haven't changed the readmes, though. I guess no one ever reads the documentation. :-D

I've noticed a more relaxed attitude regarding Daz Gen 3 figure derivatives, yes. Mostly I see it in clones or obvious appropriation of parts in freebies that is happening in plain sight. Not the sort of clumsy, blunt sleight of hand thing I would care to tempt the legal consequences of. I've actually noticed a general sort of attitude of denial or solipsism in the Poserverse. It's like a bunch of ship wreck survivors clinging to driftwood with fins circling in the night... "hey, wasn't Mac there last night?" "Shut up, I don't know no Mac" :D

Well, not that bad but I have noticed some weird things... or maybe it was always there.


hborre ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 6:23 PM

"I'm curious what magical combination of difficulty it is exactly that makes WM A3 such a Pipe Dream."

Let's consider that other Poser users were very keen to convert Sydney to weight mapping and gave up very soon afterward when it was discovered that her particular mesh was asymmetrical and a mess to correct.  I'm not saying that Aiko 3 falls under the same category, but someone would need to invest quite a bit of time with her in order to iron out any issues that may exist.  The Frankensteining technique always fascinated me; actually, a very long time ago someone posted a tutorial on the process, something I didn't pursue at the time.  I was quite impressed.


primorge ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 6:34 PM

I recall Shvrdavid (spelling?) doing quite a lot with Sydney. I also recall the asymmetry problem. And not just with a particular figure but with Poser in general. I'm not certain of any glaring specific issues with A3, it's been a while since I looked. I have a ton of A3 content though, probably more than most of the other Poser figures I have. Some of her classic clothing items are just gorgeously modeled. From a personal perspective I always found her face TOO high poly to morph comfortably, which sounds like a strange statement but there's specific reasons.


hborre ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 7:46 PM

There is something to be said about the Generation 3's, whenever you go back to them it's like a brand new experience and appreciation to how well they have stood up over time.  I might see myself during more with A3 this coming year and probably throw in Hiro 3 as well, he is a very underappreciated and forgotten figure.


primorge ( ) posted Fri, 24 December 2021 at 7:58 PM

A3 is definitely a grassroots beloved Poser figure :)


Y-Phil ( ) posted Sat, 25 December 2021 at 3:49 AM

primorge posted at 7:58 PM Fri, 24 December 2021 - #4432377

A3 is definitely a grassroots beloved Poser figure :)

Hearing you both speaking of A3 characters all of a sudden made my most beloved A3 character woke up

CaDeifxrCBGBGIKU3X1fqvKtAzIjCwp9iWvv8zMI.jpg

Be careful: I wouldn't want to see her go mad... 😂

Y-Phil.


Win10 on i7 8700K@4.3Ghz, 32Gb, GeForce RTX 2080 Ti, 2x 2Tb ssd + 1x 6Tb hd, Poser 11, Poser 12, Octane, HDR Light Studio


shvrdavid ( ) posted Sat, 25 December 2021 at 9:54 AM · edited Sat, 25 December 2021 at 9:54 AM

Content Advisory! This message contains nudity

I indeed started to weight map Sydney. I quickly discovered that Sydney's mesh is in no way symmetrical. I don't remember who actually owns the Sydney mesh anymore, but correcting it was not a legal option. We even considered doing a script that corrected the mesh since that would in no way have any of Sydney's info in it, and that was not an allowable option either. The mesh is horribly asymmetrical, not just a little bit either. That was done on purpose, from what I was told. The asymmetry was only one of many reasons the majority of the old figures never got weight mapped versions released.

Sydney is also a geometry swapping character (hip), which is not supported with Poser weight mapping. Most of the older characters that I weight mapped were never released for similar reasons. Lack of support for geometry swapping and asymmetry issues that wreck havoc with weight mapping. Then there is the permission issue, to modify existing geometry. 

Here is the fully corrected Sydney, mostly quads, no geometry swapping, aptly named, Sydney 3: Never released, never will be. The body is completely new, head hands and feet are corrected from Sydney. I don't remember how many different UV sets there were off the top of my head. There were more than a few options, obviously including Sydney's original UV's.

GoMy3ChWwDloPGlR6jjWVMMzqrQ1lgMJokSBJkDQ.jpg

On top of completely redoing more than a few characters wireframes.... A small group of us spent months weight mapping everything that came with Poser, (animals, people, etc, all of them...) just to be shut down, blocked, whatever you want to call it. Simply because it was old content and never going to be supported weight map wise due to issues mentioned earlier. And if you can't get permission to release derivatives, well, you can use them for personal use....

I still Beta test Poser, but do very little in the way of content for it. Maybe when I retire.... I mostly just read the forums now, lurking.... 

Happy Holidays, Poser'ing, etc, everyone.



Some things are easy to explain, others are not....


primorge ( ) posted Sat, 25 December 2021 at 10:11 AM

Thanks for the background info shvrdavid. Hopefully you return in more than a lurking capacity eventually; your experience and tech knowledge of Poser is surely a valuable resource.

Happy Holidays.


randym77 ( ) posted Sat, 25 December 2021 at 10:37 AM

Why would they intentionally make meshes asymmetrical? Is it a DRM thing?


shvrdavid ( ) posted Sat, 25 December 2021 at 12:51 PM

randym77 posted at 10:37 AM Sat, 25 December 2021 - #4432405

Why would they intentionally make meshes asymmetrical? Is it a DRM thing?

I have no clue why they would have taken the extra time to do so. The asymmetry is obviously blatantly intentional in some areas, and just sloppiness in others. There are huge differences ranging from the obvious differences and duplicates on Sydney's chest, to areas that are just lines of loose vertex's. I have come to the conclusion that they made the included figures crappy so there would be no need to ever support them, which is exactly what occurred with the vast majority of them. Others have come to the conclusion that they got what they paid for and hired people to make the figures that either did not have a clue how to mirror model a figure, or were so pressed for time that errors were never corrected.

Time will tell what happens now Poser wise. Bondware is off to a great start and have the people to make it very successful. I have used Poser for years and want to see it continue to advance and succeed. I have been active in the beta program since P8, so it is safe to say I am going to be using it for a long time to come.

Anyway, back to the topic of V4/M4 products.... Carry on... Cheers...



Some things are easy to explain, others are not....


WandW ( ) posted Sun, 26 December 2021 at 6:43 PM · edited Sun, 26 December 2021 at 6:44 PM

randym77 posted at 12:30 PM Fri, 24 December 2021 - #4432361

Could be. RTEncoder is kind of a pain. I've noticed DAZ no longer requires it for older products sold in their store. Like Melody for A3. Probably too much of a pain dealing with RTEncoder tech support. They haven't changed the readmes, though. I guess no one ever reads the documentation. :-D

DAZ changed their EULA several years ago; basically one can distribute derived works so long as it requires the original purchased work to function.   Otherwise, it is the exception when their documentation is useful. 

This is a render I did many years ago of a  beta of shvrdavid's weightmapped Sydney, asymmetry and all.  It was a nice figure with a few quirks, but because of the asymmetrical geometry (not asymmetric in shape, which could be dealt with,  but the number of polys varied from one side to the other!!), fixing those quirks would drive one to drink, because one could not mirror the weightmaps, but had to do each side separately.  To this day I still don't understand why SM wouldn't allow distribution of the modified figures and Syd 3...

BNTCMkX8lexnr4qNc6Pe0CAO0L2mxnifebfEP9qg.jpg

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randym77 ( ) posted Sun, 26 December 2021 at 10:20 PM

I don't think Melody requires A3 to function any more, even though it's just A3's body with a new head.

It used to require RTEncoder. It no longer does, but they didn't change the readme.

Picture me firing up RTEncoder, trying to remember how it works, and scouring my runtime for the .rte file.

There wasn't one. Though the documentation says you need RTEncoder, and includes instructions on how to use it, you just install it like you would any other figure. It's not encoded at all.


Y-Phil ( ) posted Mon, 27 December 2021 at 5:26 AM

WandW posted at 6:43 PM Sun, 26 December 2021 - #4432450

randym77 posted at 12:30 PM Fri, 24 December 2021 - #4432361

Could be. RTEncoder is kind of a pain. I've noticed DAZ no longer requires it for older products sold in their store. Like Melody for A3. Probably too much of a pain dealing with RTEncoder tech support. They haven't changed the readmes, though. I guess no one ever reads the documentation. :-D

DAZ changed their EULA several years ago; basically one can distribute derived works so long as it requires the original purchased work to function.   Otherwise, it is the exception when their documentation is useful. 

This is a render I did many years ago of a  beta of shvrdavid's weightmapped Sydney, asymmetry and all.  It was a nice figure with a few quirks, but because of the asymmetrical geometry (not asymmetric in shape, which could be dealt with,  but the number of polys varied from one side to the other!!), fixing those quirks would drive one to drink, because one could not mirror the weightmaps, but had to do each side separately.  To this day I still don't understand why SM wouldn't allow distribution of the modified figures and Syd 3...

BNTCMkX8lexnr4qNc6Pe0CAO0L2mxnifebfEP9qg.jpg

Woah... she's really cute 😍

Y-Phil.


Win10 on i7 8700K@4.3Ghz, 32Gb, GeForce RTX 2080 Ti, 2x 2Tb ssd + 1x 6Tb hd, Poser 11, Poser 12, Octane, HDR Light Studio


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