Shane, I know I'm not the norm.  And I know student loans are now something that has to be reckoned with, but I also know higher education of the formal kind wasn't for me.  Out of my high school class, all eighteen of us, I was the only one that didn't go on to college, but I made a beeline for what I found interesting, or, what I was suited for.  I had to leave California to do it, never regretted that move, and I'm not a native Californian anyhow. 

Union area, at that time, yes.  Now, only a few companies still here that are union, and with grovelmore walker, they probably won't be much longer.  Insurance, I know exactly what people mean when they say they can't look for other work because of insurance reasons.  My kid with pre-existing conditions, and my wife with her problems, if I'd left, I could forget about insurance. 

The only way a credit card isn't a rip is the way I use it, pay it down to zero as soon as the bill comes in.  Anything else, you know why I call them bankruptcy cards.  They're a fast way to bankruptcy.  I use my checking a lot, cash a little, CC only when I make an on line purchase, which isn't often.  And more than not, I'll use the phone to order rather than on line.  Some of the websites I order from have an even worse search than rendo forums, some others if they're out of stock, I know it immediately.  A lot of the things I order won't be available again once the current stock is gone.  But that's me and my situation, I do realize others may not be in the same place. Doric

The "I" in Doric is Silent.