yeah, they are not great, but my point was to say that, despite the hobby throngs over at poser, and despite the sorry fact that many vendors paint highlights onto hair and skin textures, and despite the inept usage of said tools, the app itself is capable of resolving very fine details and very fine effects. You know, there are not many studios, from Dreamworks/Pixar on down to the one-person desktop, animating hyper-realism in-close. I'm about to render a new example, will post here beginning of the week or when done. Would welcome close and tough examination from you. ::::: Opera :::::