actually, I'm aware that 'rosity used red hat. but when the admin in question made the post about them having just upgraded, she said linux 8, and would not clarify. which is why I figured to point out publicy why linux 8 is a bad way of putting it. through this thread. and yup, I'm using Mandrake. and fur, Mandrake 9 is stable, and uses latest stable kernel. 9.1 uses latest stable threaded kernel and comes with apache2.43 ( right now ) with fully 88 modules for apache included. no tiresome compile form source to get the modules you want. by the time 9.1 is released, probably have 2.0.44 instead of 2.043 I also have the latest debian woody, and rh 8, and free bsd, and slackware here. as well as kernel 2.5 sources for working with in development.